Mutua Madrid Open 2017 Clay Masters

[Front242]

In his peak, Nole mixed Fed offense with Rafa defense. In his decline/slump, he lacked Fed shot making or Rafa control of UE.

So true. He's dropped a whole tier below them both. Like a completely different player right now although he showed some semblance of his former self at times towards the end of set 2. Even the point he lost the match on was a sloppy, poor miss but, then again, he's double faulted away matches in his prime too at RG and Rome.

 

[Puppet Master]

In his peak, Nole mixed Fed offense with Rafa defense. In his decline/slump, he lacked Fed shot making or Rafa control of UE.

Fed offense and Rafa defense? HAHAHAHA
Yeah ok. I won't argue, I don't eveb care. Believe what you want.

 

[Front242]

He never had the ability to end points as quickly as Federer but his offense WAS a whole lot better than it is now as was his defense. He's not even close to beating top 5 opponents in his current state with the exception of Murray who's also in a pretty bad slump lately.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Vamos Nadal

 

[Puppet Master]

He never had the ability to end points as quickly as Federer but his offense WAS a whole lot better than it is now as was his defense. He's not even close to beating top 5 opponents in his current state with the exception of Murray who's also in a pretty bad slump lately.

There is this thing, I could swear I saw someone mention it yesterday on the forums. You might have heard of it. Decline maybe?????
Do you know of it?
How to assess the way (soon to be) No5e is playing? The consistency of his shots is horrific. He is basically a top 30 player right now. Can play the top guys, can even push them very hard, but just can't outbox them. He can't go more than one game without making an unforced error and Nadal is the worst one to play in that case, because he will punish you for it, every single time. That is, if he isn't playing like dog crap himself.
With things looking the way they are for him, I don't see his form improving at all at least until USO. Maybe not even then. But as far as I know, he is expecting a child at that time, so even more distractions. 2017 could get very ugly for some.

PS: Nadal is number one in the race to London, for the unaware.

 

[Kieran]

Rafa ticked all the boxes there, alright. He was stupendous in the first set. Novak was nervous at the beginning, but rafa took control. Often tension like that spreads to the other side of the net, and Rafa has been prone to stumbling anxiety at the wrong times this year, but he was brilliant. Novak grunted and roared his way back to 2-2 in the second, more boxes for Rafa to tick: break back immediately? Check! Hold serve, and hold nerve? Check? Correct any stumbles that followed? Check!

He was immense today, the best I've seen from him since 2013. He outhit and out-fought Novak. Yeah, I know that Djoker hasn't been himself in almost a year, but sheesh, he got a lot of matches like this against Rafa since 2014, when Rafa was sh1te. Great to see the Clay King look kingly again... :clap

 

[Front242]

I don't personally think it's decline 'cos it's been so steep. He just looked slow and sluggish out there today. People can say what they want but to me it's pretty clear that what he was on before he sure as hell is off now and that's the bottom line. It may not have been an illegal substance, maybe something borderline illegal on moral grounds a la Sharadopa but very much performance enhancing that they have now banned so hence the massive drop off in performance. He's even talked about wanting to get his stamina back which should sound suss to most if they put their minds to it. To me it says the stuff I was on is now banned so I need to find something new pronto. But then call me cynical, I don't care. I think there's a lot of sense to it though personally going by what we're all seeing on court.

“I want to continue raising the level of my game and stamina and this is a continuous process"

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2017/05/05/novak-djokovic-splits-coach-fitness-trainer-physio-aim-find/

^ You don't continually raise the level of your stamina and game as you get older so if he's trying to do that legally it's head scratching.

 

[Haelfix]

Novak's beginning to lose half a step and it's effecting his balance. That's why you see some of the flailing, and it of course makes a big difference for long grindathon rallies against players who don't give up mistakes like Rafa. It also effects his depth of shot, which was landing in Rafas wheelhouse.

This happened to Fed in 2008, it happened to Rafa as well several times throughout his career and it usually can take six months to a year to settle into a new normal.

I think Novak will start having to play a little more offensive now to limit some of the long rallies.

 

[Kieran]

^ You don't continually raise the level of your stamina and game as you get older so if he's trying to do that legally it's head scratching.

I agree. Been saying it since I watched Federer in Oz, actually...

 

[Front242]

^ You don't continually raise the level of your stamina and game as you get older so if he's trying to do that legally it's head scratching.

I agree. Been saying it since I watched Federer in Oz, actually...

Sigh. Was waiting for that :cover Federer is merely hitting his backhand much harder and going for his shots more in general. His stamina is NOT better. He wins matches faster due to his aggressive game. This has been discussed to death already.

 

[the AntiPusher]

I don't personally think it's decline 'cos it's been so steep. He just looked slow and sluggish out there today. People can say what they want but to me it's pretty clear that what he was on before he sure as hell is off now and that's the bottom line. It may not have been an illegal substance, maybe something borderline illegal on moral grounds a la Sharadopa but very much performance enhancing that they have now banned so hence the massive drop off in performance. He's even talked about wanting to get his stamina back which should sound suss to most if they put their minds to it. To me it says the stuff I was on is now banned so I need to find something new pronto. But then call me cynical, I don't care. I think there's a lot of sense to it though personally going by what we're all seeing on court.

“I want to continue raising the level of my game and stamina and this is a continuous process"

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2017/05/05/novak-djokovic-splits-coach-fitness-trainer-physio-aim-find/

^ You don't continually raise the level of your stamina and game as you get older so if he's trying to do that legally it's head scratching.

So if your argument is true, Novak's energy was up and now it's down because you say he is not "on " It anymore...how does that contrast to Roger's meteoric rise

 

[Puppet Master]

I don't personally think it's decline 'cos it's been so steep. He just looked slow and sluggish out there today. People can say what they want but to me it's pretty clear that what he was on before he sure as hell is off now and that's the bottom line. It may not have been an illegal substance, maybe something borderline illegal on moral grounds a la Sharadopa but very much performance enhancing that they have now banned so hence the massive drop off in performance. He's even talked about wanting to get his stamina back which should sound suss to most if they put their minds to it. To me it says the stuff I was on is now banned so I need to find something new pronto. But then call me cynical, I don't care. I think there's a lot of sense to it though personally going by what we're all seeing on court.

“I want to continue raising the level of my game and stamina and this is a continuous process"

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2017/05/05/novak-djokovic-splits-coach-fitness-trainer-physio-aim-find/

^ You don't continually raise the level of your stamina and game as you get older so if he's trying to do that legally it's head scratching.

I remember when he was trying to sell a new excuse, in an interview, this year I believe, he said that he strained his mind and body too much in 2015-2016 and it's bad for him so he stopped. *cough cough *dangerous chemicals and/or hormones *cough cough

 

[Front242]

^ There you go, see. It's plain as day obvious to me anyway.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Rafa hit 20 winners.,( is what I just read on the other board) ..that's fantastic

 

[Fiero425]

I don't personally think it's decline 'cos it's been so steep. He just looked slow and sluggish out there today. People can say what they want but to me it's pretty clear that what he was on before he sure as hell is off now and that's the bottom line. It may not have been an illegal substance, maybe something borderline illegal on moral grounds a la Sharadopa but very much performance enhancing that they have now banned so hence the massive drop off in performance. He's even talked about wanting to get his stamina back which should sound suss to most if they put their minds to it. To me it says the stuff I was on is now banned so I need to find something new pronto. But then call me cynical, I don't care. I think there's a lot of sense to it though personally going by what we're all seeing on court.

“I want to continue raising the level of my game and stamina and this is a continuous process"

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2017/05/05/novak-djokovic-splits-coach-fitness-trainer-physio-aim-find/

^ You don't continually raise the level of your stamina and game as you get older so if he's trying to do that legally it's head scratching.

So if your argument is true, Novak's energy was up and now it's down because you say he is not "on " It anymore...how does that contrast to Roger's meteoric rise

Maybe Nole should be checked by a psychic! :zzz: Roger might be draining him while he sleeps; hence the lethargy & apathy!:woohoos :eyepop :devil

 

[Front242]

I don't personally think it's decline 'cos it's been so steep. He just looked slow and sluggish out there today. People can say what they want but to me it's pretty clear that what he was on before he sure as hell is off now and that's the bottom line. It may not have been an illegal substance, maybe something borderline illegal on moral grounds a la Sharadopa but very much performance enhancing that they have now banned so hence the massive drop off in performance. He's even talked about wanting to get his stamina back which should sound suss to most if they put their minds to it. To me it says the stuff I was on is now banned so I need to find something new pronto. But then call me cynical, I don't care. I think there's a lot of sense to it though personally going by what we're all seeing on court.

“I want to continue raising the level of my game and stamina and this is a continuous process"

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2017/05/05/novak-djokovic-splits-coach-fitness-trainer-physio-aim-find/

^ You don't continually raise the level of your stamina and game as you get older so if he's trying to do that legally it's head scratching.

So if your argument is true, Novak's energy was up and now it's down because you say he is not "on " It anymore...how does that contrast to Roger's meteoric rise

Again, Roger's massively improved his backhand against EVERYONE, not just Nadal. That's the reason. He has NOT improved his stamina. Only silly people are claiming this as it's obvious the guy is playing super aggressive because he clearly knows it's the only way to stay with the younger guys as he's no spring chicken. Because it's a working strategy and he's kicking ass this year, people have to spout all this nonsense. But it's blind nonsense that hasn't been thought out reasonably because he's not out there grinding at all so there's clearly not a massive stamina increase at all. Wait till Wimbledon comes round and Roger will be off the court in most of the early rounds in 1.5 hours max and the others, Murray, Djokovic and Nadal in particular will be out there much longer all because of how they play. Too much defensive and rallying and not enough intuition to pull the trigger.

 

[DarthFed]

Novak Djokovic has the same name as always but only that. He isn't even a top 20 level player at this point. You only have to watch 2 games to see he has lost a step or step and a half and he has no power on any of his shots. Boris has a loud mouth but he isn't always dishonest and he said that Nole has not been working hard since winning RG. I think there's a decent chance that this is his main issue. He has to find some motivation and soon or he is done. We won't hear anything from Nole for at least 4-5 more months, id be surprised if he makes QF of RG

 

[Front242]

Is it possible for someone other than non Rafa fan tell me How Rafa was able to change the tide today

He was better? That pretty much is the story lol. From a non fan or otherwise, that's the bottom line.

 

[Carol]

And more sour grapes....

 

[DarthFed]

You'd think by the way Kieran is talking that Roger played a 5+ hour semi and was fresh as a daisy 2 days later in another match that went 5 sets and 4+ hours. Roger got the extra day off after the semi making the 5 setter a non-issue. And against Nishi he went 5 and then faced a pretty underwhelming S&V player in Zverev.

Roger has adopted an even more aggressive mindset and few opponents are even moving the old man around the court at all. He isn't moving better than even 2 years ago, he's just playing better. Also keep in mind that Roger had underachieved for most of his 30's, the haters just hoped he'd suck even worse.