Covid vaccine - opinions?

[Moxie]

@Front242 has put a lot of posts out there about how the COVID vaccine has killed people. Maybe @tented or @kskate2 can shift or copy some of them over here, or maybe Front will repost. Either way, it's a worthwhile topic. How are we feeling about the new vaccine as an option? Nervous? Enthusiastic? All-in? Not in at all?

 

[Carol]

Florida today 17.783 contagious. I really don't understand with or without vaccine the numbers goes up

 

[Front242]

Florida today 17.783 contagious. I really don't understand with or without vaccine the numbers goes up

Current vaccines out there are laughable. Not enough testing done, they don't know if they'll stop transmission or simply reduce symptoms. They think it's "likely" (great scientific backup and hope for mankind's trust in them) they'll work on the mutations and strains that are causing big issues eg in the UK and South Africa. A nurse died 2 days after getting the Pfizer "vaccine". I'm not anti vaccine but I'm definitely anti not properly tested covid bs vaccines where the public are being used as guinea pigs and won't ever take any of this poorly tested p1S$. Countries and employers making this mandatory should be ashamed of themselves. It's a violation of basic human rights to get injected with this crap that they have no damn idea of the long term effects, or even if it even works full stop. The nurse who died 2 days later says "hi Pfizer and f**k you."

https://www.republicworld.com/world...zer-biontechs-coronavirus-vaccine-report.html

Pharmaceutical companies being given indemnification for their pathetic rushed vaccines basically spells this: We know they don't work properly but we're gonna get rich asf and if you get sick or die you can't sue us. What a world we live in.

I very much admire the ex vice president of Pfizer for saying this.

“There is absolutely no need for vaccines to extinguish the pandemic. I’ve never heard such nonsense talked about vaccines. You do not vaccinate people who aren’t at risk from a disease. You also don’t set about planning to vaccinate millions of fit and healthy people with a vaccine that hasn’t been extensively tested on human subjects.”

https://www.nationalheraldindia.com...-is-over-says-former-vice-president-of-pfizer

^ Couldn't have said it better. Why the hell would any sane and healthy person take this crap, many of which change your DNA? The world has gone f***ing nuts over a virus with a 98% recovery rate.

 

[Front242]

Current vaccines out there are laughable. Not enough testing done, they don't know if they'll stop transmission or simply reduce symptoms. They think it's "likely" (great scientific backup and hope for mankind's trust in them) they'll work on the mutations and strains that are causing big issues eg in the UK and South Africa. A nurse died 2 days after getting the Pfizer "vaccine". I'm not anti vaccine but I'm definitely anti not properly tested covid bs vaccines where the public are being used as guinea pigs and won't ever take any of this poorly tested p1S$. Countries and employers making this mandatory should be ashamed of themselves. It's a violation of basic human rights to get injected with this crap that they have no damn idea of the long term effects, or even if it even works full stop. The nurse who died 2 days later says "hi Pfizer and f**k you."

https://www.republicworld.com/world...zer-biontechs-coronavirus-vaccine-report.html

Pharmaceutical companies being given indemnification for their pathetic rushed vaccines basically spells this: We know they don't work properly but we're gonna get rich asf and if you get sick or die you can't sue us. What a world we live in.

I very much admire the ex vice president of Pfizer for saying this.

“There is absolutely no need for vaccines to extinguish the pandemic. I’ve never heard such nonsense talked about vaccines. You do not vaccinate people who aren’t at risk from a disease. You also don’t set about planning to vaccinate millions of fit and healthy people with a vaccine that hasn’t been extensively tested on human subjects.”

https://www.nationalheraldindia.com...-is-over-says-former-vice-president-of-pfizer

^ Couldn't have said it better. Why the hell would any sane and healthy person take this crap, many of which change your DNA? The world has gone f***ing nuts over a virus with a 98% recovery rate.

Another death due to Pfizer's "vaccine". Miami doctor 56 years old died 3 weeks after they injected him with this not properly tested poisonous p1S$. Everything is pointing towards the wise words of the ex VP of Pfizer.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/miami-dade/miami-beach/article248337525.html

"was vaccinated at Mount Sinai on Dec. 18 and within three days he noticed bruising on his feet and hands, which prompted his hospitalization. Doctors at the hospital diagnosed him with Immune thrombocytopenia, or ITP, a blood disorder caused by an immune reaction, Neckelmann said. Michael died of a stroke after attempts to raise his platelet count were unsuccessful.


“He was a very healthy 56 year old, loved by everyone in the community, delivered hundreds of healthy babies and worked tireless through the pandemic,”

 

[Carol]

This is a very bad news, where are we go??????????

Florida has nearly half of known US cases of COVID variant

The Centers for Disease Control says Florida has nearly half of the known cases in the U.S. of a mutated and likely more contagious strain of the coronavirus.

www.local10.com

 

[Front242]

Come on, @Front242, you're such a grump! You're against the vaccine, because of a few suspect reactions. Now you want to say it will be a crap AO, because they're not match-ready. They're trying to play some tennis, and they won't be rolling straight into the AO, you get that, right? There are tune-ups and an exhibition. They are professional athletes, and if they don't know how to keep themselves in some kind of shape, then that's on them. It's not like they're going to sit around in their hotel rooms and just get fat and lazy. Or if they do, I have nothing to say about their professionalism. The USO and the FO managed to pull off a Major. Tennis Australia has clearly put a lot of thought and preparation into this one. It's worth remembering that, while the top players could happily live off of their past-earnings, a lot of players need to keep playing to stay in the game. I, personally, appreciate how hard the Aussies have worked to get tennis players there, to organize events in a consolidated way, and keep tennis going in the midst of this pandemic. Is this the best of circumstances? No, it is not. But the options are to give up, or keep moving forward. Which would you prefer?

Well obviously it's better to have the tournament than not at all like Wimbledon which was cancelled, but 72 players unable to do SFA is not good and doesn't bode well. I'll watch the final as that's probably all I'll be able to see with work and the time difference here. It's not about fitness, they're being given exercise equipment if they want it and I'd imagine most will opt for this unless they're insane It's about the lack of practice for 14 days which is a long time to be without the rhythm of playing. No, I'm not against the vaccine because of suspect reactions, I'm against it because it's killing people and hasn't been tested properly at all, Pfizer's being the worst one. Norway have reported 23 deaths from the "vaccine" and I admire their transparency. Other countries reporting tons of old people dying might want to look at why numbers have suddenly gone even higher since this supposed miracle cure was introduced end of December and I don't think they need to look too hard tbh. Killing the very people they're trying to protect through the vaccine is working really well. Take a bow once again, Pfizer.

"The Norwegian Medicines Agency linked 13 deaths to the corona vaccine’s side effects. Those who died had two things in common – they were old and frail. A total of 23 deaths have been reported in connection with the corona vaccination."

Many old people are frail but that's no reason to give them something that's going to kill them sooner than if they ever got covid19.

https://norwaytoday.info/news/norwe...de-effects-those-who-died-were-frail-and-old/

 

[Moxie]

Well obviously it's better to have the tournament than not at all like Wimbledon which was cancelled, but 72 players unable to do SFA is not good and doesn't bode well. I'll watch the final as that's probably all I'll be able to see with work and the time difference here. It's not about fitness, they're being given exercise equipment if they want it and I'd imagine most will opt for this unless they're insane It's about the lack of practice for 14 days which is a long time to be without the rhythm of playing. No, I'm not against the vaccine because of suspect reactions, I'm against it because it's killing people and hasn't been tested properly at all, Pfizer's being the worst one. Norway have reported 23 deaths from the "vaccine" and I admire their transparency. Other countries reporting tons of old people dying might want to look at why numbers have suddenly gone even higher since this supposed miracle cure was introduced end of December and I don't think they need to look too hard tbh. Killing the very people they're trying to protect through the vaccine is working really well. Take a bow once again, Pfizer.

"The Norwegian Medicines Agency linked 13 deaths to the corona vaccine’s side effects. Those who died had two things in common – they were old and frail. A total of 23 deaths have been reported in connection with the corona vaccination."

Many old people are frail but that's no reason to give them something that's going to kill them sooner than if they ever got covid19.

https://norwaytoday.info/news/norwe...de-effects-those-who-died-were-frail-and-old/

I get why Wimbledon cancelled...it was early in the pandemic, they had a short window to pull off the tournament, and they had the insurance, which they were able to spread out to players. All-in-all, wise decisions on their part. Australia has had a long time to plan this, with two successful Majors before them to model after, and I think they're doing a good job of protecting players/teams and their own citizens. I can't figure out what "SFA" is, because I'm a dummy. I get that it'll be hard to do without enough practice, and match-play, but my point (above) was that everyone is in the same boat. (Which @Ricardo didn't seem to get.) This was also somewhat true when sanctioned tennis resumed in August. Sure, some had played exhibitions, and some played Cincy/USO and others didn't. But those that played what was left of the 2020 season all started back up in the unusual position of not having played much "real" tennis for 4+ months. This will be similar. They'll have to rely on their fitness discipline. They young ones will have their youthful resilience, and the older ones their sang-froid and experience.

As to the vaccine, I image that the Admins might prefer that we take that conversation to the World Affairs section. I'm happy to start it a thread, as it is a very interesting topic.

 

[Horsa]

We're on our 3rd total lockdown. I want to go out & do archiving, & do arts & crafts workshops at work, art history classes at work & book club & choir practice as well as the teaching & musical parts of my job again instead of staying at home, quilting, knitting, ceramic painting & online archiving & research & report-writing tasks. I know I've still got a lot to do, writing about equine history, then American slavery, then an events planning task before discussing my favourite museum, drawing artefacts & writing poems about them, learning to crochet & learning to like & sing opera but I want to go into work. I want to see my colleagues. All this reading, writing & computing isn't good for my eyes. I keep getting head-aches. We were getting our freedom back a bit at a time then some people took advantage & didn't follow the rules & the rates went back up. We've been told that vaccinating everyone starting from those who work with vulnerable people & vulnerable people is the way out so although I don't like needles I want the jab as it's the only way to get our freedom back. I'm very sorry for all those who died & hope as many people are healthy as possible. I know this virus is bad as a few colleagues of my Sister got it & got over it & my cousin has got it. I hope my cousin is o.k. I hope at some point we can go places without masks/visors as they're no good for my breathing. I also hope to go back to the vocal part of my job again.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

As a front line worker I am able to received the COVID-19 vaccination in March/April in Australia.We are receiving 2 different types of COVID-19 vaccines.One thing that disturbs me is 'how fast' these vaccines have been made.Usually it takes up to two years for a vaccination to be put through different testings on animals,people etc.I think the main reason for speed of the vaccinations because it is a 'world wide pandemic' like any vaccination it will have side effects and people of any age should be made aware of actually what is in these vaccinations before having it administered.I would also like to point out that these vaccinations are not 100% that you will not catch COVID-19,though if by chance you do get the virus it won't be as bad,then if you do not have the vaccine,a bit like the flu injection which I get every year,seeing I am with patients all the time.I have worked in ICU with COVID-19 patients and it is most confronting.

 

[Horsa]

As a front line worker I am able to received the COVID-19 vaccination in March/April in Australia.We are receiving 2 different types of COVID-19 vaccines.One thing that disturbs me is 'how fast' these vaccines have been made.Usually it takes up to two years for a vaccination to be put through different testings on animals,people etc.I think the main reason for speed of the vaccinations because it is a 'world wide pandemic' like any vaccination it will have side effects and people of any age should be made aware of actually what is in these vaccinations before having it administered.I would also like to point out that these vaccinations are not 100% that you will not catch COVID-19,though if by chance you do get the virus it won't be as bad,then if you do not have the vaccine,a bit like the flu injection which I get every year,seeing I am with patients all the time.I have worked in ICU with COVID-19 patients and it is most confronting.

I agree. They haven't been through as much vigorous testing as they normally go through. We don't know how safe & effective they really are & what the side-effects will be. I hope everything goes well for you.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

I agree. They haven't been through as much vigorous testing as they normally go through. We don't know how safe & effective they really are & what the side-effects will be. I hope everything goes well for you.

Agree.

 

[JesuslookslikeBorg]

i took my mum who is 83 to have her 1st pfizer jab on jan 8th, went ok.

 

[Moxie]

Well obviously it's better to have the tournament than not at all like Wimbledon which was cancelled, but 72 players unable to do SFA is not good and doesn't bode well. I'll watch the final as that's probably all I'll be able to see with work and the time difference here. It's not about fitness, they're being given exercise equipment if they want it and I'd imagine most will opt for this unless they're insane It's about the lack of practice for 14 days which is a long time to be without the rhythm of playing. No, I'm not against the vaccine because of suspect reactions, I'm against it because it's killing people and hasn't been tested properly at all, Pfizer's being the worst one. Norway have reported 23 deaths from the "vaccine" and I admire their transparency. Other countries reporting tons of old people dying might want to look at why numbers have suddenly gone even higher since this supposed miracle cure was introduced end of December and I don't think they need to look too hard tbh. Killing the very people they're trying to protect through the vaccine is working really well. Take a bow once again, Pfizer.

"The Norwegian Medicines Agency linked 13 deaths to the corona vaccine’s side effects. Those who died had two things in common – they were old and frail. A total of 23 deaths have been reported in connection with the corona vaccination."

Many old people are frail but that's no reason to give them something that's going to kill them sooner than if they ever got covid19.

https://norwaytoday.info/news/norwe...de-effects-those-who-died-were-frail-and-old/

I understand why people are nervous about a vaccine that feels rather rushed through, but the two cases you stated before are definitely far from absolutely tied to the vaccine...it was weeks later...and the Norwegians saying that some frail and old may have died from it is far from telling us that it is "poisonous p$ss." So far more than 44 million shots have been given worldwide. You have anecdotally reported a few deaths and they are only possibly been attributed to the jab. Some cases of anafalactic reaction have been reported, which is fixable by a shot. Compare this to the 2 million plus people who have died from COVID-19 in the past year. I, for one, am happy to see a vaccine.

Also, you should understand that this vaccine wasn't created from whole cloth. There has existed a structure for a vaccine, onto which they hang the specific RDNA of the new virus, once identified. It's not that shocking that they created it in such a short amount of time. There was incentive, and political will. If you look at the science, and not just a few voodoo scary internet posts, you'd realize there is a lot to back it up. I know a lot of medical professionals who have already taken it, and very happily, and I suspect they know more than you and I do about how Big Pharma works.

 

[britbox]

I wouldn't go near any of the current vaccine candidates. Only know one person who took it, and he's now dead.

 

[Moxie]

I wouldn't go near any of the current vaccine candidates. Only know one person who took it, and he's now dead.

I'm very sorry to hear that. What did he die of?

 

[Horsa]

i took my mum who is 83 to have her 1st pfizer jab on jan 8th, went ok.

I'm glad. I hope everything goes well with her. Take care of both of you.

 

[Front242]

I understand why people are nervous about a vaccine that feels rather rushed through, but the two cases you stated before are definitely far from absolutely tied to the vaccine...it was weeks later...and the Norwegians saying that some frail and old may have died from it is far from telling us that it is "poisonous p$ss." So far more than 44 million shots have been given worldwide. You have anecdotally reported a few deaths and they are only possibly been attributed to the jab. Some cases of anafalactic reaction have been reported, which is fixable by a shot. Compare this to the 2 million plus people who have died from COVID-19 in the past year. I, for one, am happy to see a vaccine.

Also, you should understand that this vaccine wasn't created from whole cloth. There has existed a structure for a vaccine, onto which they hang the specific RDNA of the new virus, once identified. It's not that shocking that they created it in such a short amount of time. There was incentive, and political will. If you look at the science, and not just a few voodoo scary internet posts, you'd realize there is a lot to back it up. I know a lot of medical professionals who have already taken it, and very happily, and I suspect they know more than you and I do about how Big Pharma works.

So we're supposed to believe all the countries not reporting stuff truthfully? Huge laugh at China's reported lies in that case I'm sure most here would agree. 4635 deaths ?! ROFL! Probably need to add on 3 zeroes to get the correct total there. Deaths in the US and UK (1610 deaths reported in the UK today - they NEVER had these numbers before the vaccines came along) have gone through the roof since the end of December and that ties in with the date the "vaccines" were introduced so I'd say that's some coincidence. Frail and old people who would not have died if not given this crap in the first place and deserved better than what untimely demise Pfizer brought them. There's also a reason pharma companies have been indemnified with their "vaccines", namely you can't sue us because we know damn well there will be issues. Shocking world we live in.

 

[Moxie]

So we're supposed to believe all the countries not reporting stuff truthfully? Huge laugh at China's reported lies in that case I'm sure most here would agree. 4635 deaths ?! ROFL! Probably need to add on 3 zeroes to get the correct total there. Deaths in the US and UK (1610 deaths reported in the UK today - they NEVER had these numbers before the vaccines came along) have gone through the roof since the end of December and that ties in with the date the "vaccines" were introduced so I'd say that's some coincidence. Frail and old people who would not have died if not given this crap in the first place and deserved better than what untimely demise Pfizer brought them. There's also a reason pharma companies have been indemnified with their "vaccines", namely you can't sue us because we know damn well there will be issues. Shocking world we live in.

You put a lot of things in the blender there. Let's see if we can separate them:

1) Lack of transparency over reported COVID deaths: Yes, this is possible, but this is not every country in the world. Some have complained that COVID deaths are over-reported, too, so what do we do with that? However, is it not indisputable that, give or take, 2 million + deaths have occurred that are attributable to a worldwide COVID pandemic?

2) Death via vaccine: I can't speak to the UK knowledgeably, but I think they were seeing spikes before there was a vaccine. Certainly here in the US. To pretend it all got worse when the vaccine came along is risible and beyond misleading. It's lying, or lying to yourself. Show me one statistic that marks a spike in COVID deaths when the vaccine came along. Just US and/or UK is fine.

2A.) Norway on Covid vaccine deaths: You like to call Norway transparent, but they did say that they can only say that the vaccine "may" have contributed to the deaths of the very old and very frail. They are NOT confirming that, they are investigating it.
'https://www.euronews.com/2021/01/18...d-19-vaccination-deaths-says-health-authority

3.) The very old and very frail: I've made the argument that many of these people died of COVID before their time. I'm sure you're not one of those people, but there was plenty of argument around here that, hey, you're 97, you were going to die soon, anyway. I consider that a bogus argument, but same for COVID as for the vaccine. We're talking about a very vulnerable population, which is also, by-and-large more isolated than ever due to the pandemic. The question becomes if the cure is worse than the disease, for them. Overall, it does not seem yet that the cure is worse than the disease. To take one side, and not weigh the other seems foolish to me, and you seem to be only weighing one side. If you're worried about these people for the vaccine, I hope you've been, and are, worried about them for COVID.

4.) The hale and hearty, and the vaccine: If most people are not fragile and old, and those at risk (doctors, nurses, 65+) are also getting vaccinated, what is the concern, since the examples of bad reactions for them are rare? How are we expected to go back to some kind of normal if people don't get immunity to the virus? You gotta take a shot. (Which I mean in both senses of the word.)

5.) Inability to sue the manufacturers of the vaccine: Sure, this is tricky. But there are two options: bring out a vaccine as quickly as is feasible...(and there have been trials, massive ones,)...or wait 2 years, or whatever. Do you want to keep being in lockdown for 2 more years? Taking the vaccine is voluntary. So you take a risk. Moderna and Pfizer didn't create a vaccine to try to kill us. They're trying to help save us. But if they don't have some guarantee against being sued into insolvency, they wouldn't put it out there. Yes, there are older people who may be too demented to make the choice themselves, but most will have a family member or heathcare proxy who makes the choice for them. It's a calculated risk. Everyone must decide for themselves, or for their person who can't do so. And the calculations must be made based on science and evidence, not hysteria. TBH, I think you're being slightly hysterical about this.

6.) "Shocking world we live in": I agree with you on that, but for different reasons.

 

[Front242]

^ The problem is the old people are all been given this because of bs worldwide media scaremongering and they're making out these vaccines are a miracle cure. No, they're not. Today the UK had a new record over yesterday. 1820 deaths reported today and 1610 yesterday and they NEVER had deaths this high prior to end of December when these "vaccines" were rolled out. I'd say that's some coincidence! Lockdowns are pointless. They're killing the economy and what's the point with numbers like that still dying in lockdown. Countries' governments seem surprised when numbers of cases skyrocket again after lockdown ends. Duh. You don't say. What do they expect? Yes, younger people have a choice and I sure as hell won't be taking any vaccine for a virus where the official stats have 99.6% in mild condition and recovery rate of 97-98% There's no sense to that. As the ex vice president of Pfizer correctly stated:

“There is absolutely no need for vaccines to extinguish the pandemic. I’ve never heard such nonsense talked about vaccines. You do not vaccinate people who aren’t at risk from a disease. You also don’t set about planning to vaccinate millions of fit and healthy people with a vaccine that hasn’t been extensively tested on human subjects.”

What's more, I would say this is not a real pandemic and many agree. It's more of an epidemic. In a real pandemic people of all ages are dropping dead left, right and centre. With this, only a select few young people are dying or those who were very sick to begin with or had serious underlying conditions. It's basically 99% old people dying and they're the ones these vaccines are geared towards but doesn't seem to be doing too well. The South African strain has killed some healthy young people, yes, but nothing like what would happen in a real pandemic like the Spanish flu.

Why do you need to take a not properly tested vaccine to get immunity for something you may never get ? Look at the percentage of the global population who have contracted it. It's nothing. So why the need for a vaccine ? If they had extensive research into the long term side effects then maybe there may be some more inclination for some to take it but you're basically a guinea pig to poorly tested, rushed chemicals and it's a case of take it at your own risk. Pfizer's Sars vaccine gave some people narcolepsy. Unfortunately, it's being pushed so much to the public by poor governments and health officials they're being brainwashed into thinking it's the be all end all. None of the covid vaccines have been proven to stop transmission and all they think they'll do is reduce symptoms if you catch covid19.

One thing I most certainly do agree on is that deaths are being reported incorrectly. Someone on their last legs who would've died anyway is being listed as a covid death stat and that's not right. You see people saying "RIP to the poor souls" on our local forums and the article says the median age of those who died was 85 and the oldest was 99. Seriously, this is a normal time to die and absolutely any bug would've likely killed them. Man jumps out of plane with no parachute, dies of coronavirus. *SIGH*

 

[JesuslookslikeBorg]

the deaths in the uk now are a result of people meeting reletives/friends over the holidays,

incubation period is oftern 2wks or so ,and then folk are ill for ages before death, what is now happening is what was expected to happen, alot of folk had festive family meets and are now paying the price its sad to say.

and it is too late for the vax to help already infected people, seeing as antibodies take a few weeks to build up, so here we are..

the time lag with both covid illness/death and vaccine antibody build up is frustrating and catching out alot of folk, cases peaked last week and are falling, but deaths declining will take a bit longer to trickle through.