Rogers Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

[Murat B.]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

It is obvious who the favorite is on this surface, but Rafa is playing with house money and he should have absolutely no stress about this. That makes him a bit harder to play against and anything can happen. I can see Rafa getting a set. 3 setter to Nole.

 

[herios]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

In tennis anything is possible, but realistically Rafa barely beat No1e on his favourite clay earlier this year and even that only after being help by Maria (Pascal) and officials so I don't think anyone can expect him to beat No1e on cement. No1e seems to enter and exit just to enter again his 2011 form but I trust he will be in it for the semi. No1e in straight sets.

Kieran, I guess there is a very good reason why is going to a pub more interesting than this match.

so it was Pascal's fault that djoker touch the net:snigger

Stop it!. Pascal made 2 big errors in that final, both favoring Nadal at critical points in the match. He should have been suspended.

 

[Kieran]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

Stop it!. Pascal made 2 big errors in that final, both favoring Nadal at critical points in the match. He should have been suspended.

It was a semifinal.

And the ball was still in play when he touched the net!

Crikey, I didn't think Nole fans were swimming so deep in The Nile.... :nono

 

[herios]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

Stop it!. Pascal made 2 big errors in that final, both favoring Nadal at critical points in the match. He should have been suspended.

It was a semifinal.

And the ball was still in play when he touched the net!

Crikey, I didn't think Nole fans were swimming so deep in The Nile.... :nono

Sorry, it was a SF indeed.
He touched it, AFTER the double bounce, thus nope, the ball was not in play.
Also he was fooled by Rafa who pointed to a different sign left by the ball calling a ball out, while Nole's ball hit the line.
So, let's leave it at that, because even now it makes me mad when I think about it.

 

[Kieran]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

The ball was still in play! I really can't believe that anyone thinks otherwise.

And as for Rafa pointing at a mark, I don't think he deliberately pointed at the wrong mark, and I'm not certain that it was the wrong mark. It was early in the 3rd - and Nole lost that set 6-1. It hardly influenced the outcome.

Really, get over it. Your guy done well that day. He took Nadal to five...

 

[nehmeth]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

This one needs a poll. Once again the de facto final. Who wins? You have multiple options.

I like that: the defacto final :clap

Rafa looked really sharp by the 2nd set yesterday. Nole obliterated Ritchie, but methinks Roger has taught the Frenchman to lose handily to whomever is #1.

Nole spanked Ralf in Monte Carlo, only to be beaten in 5 in France. This one? I think Nole will prevail in 3.

 

[Kieran]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

methinks Roger has taught the Frenchman to lose handily to whomever is #1.

:snigger That's the truth! Did he giggle when his chin was tickled at the net when they hugged and cuddled? He loves his cuddles from the #1, does RG...

 

[Moxie]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

The ball was still in play! I really can't believe that anyone thinks otherwise.

And as for Rafa pointing at a mark, I don't think he deliberately pointed at the wrong mark, and I'm not certain that it was the wrong mark. It was early in the 3rd - and Nole lost that set 6-1. It hardly influenced the outcome.

Really, get over it. Your guy done well that day. He took Nadal to five...

Yes, Djokovic had barely hit the ball when he hit the net...he just misjudged that. As to the other, I didn't see the 3rd set, but, if it was in that one, Djokovic was on walkabout, anyway, and what would it have changed? Novak was out-played in that match and did well to take it to 5, as Kieran says. He made chances for himself, but duffed them. Same as Nadal in the AO 2012 final. Yes....get over it.

 

[DarthFed]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

I think this one means more to Djokovic than Nadal and for Rafa to win on hard courts he needs help from Djokovic. He will not hit through him and the forehand causes no damage to Nole on hard courts. Nole should come out focused and win this in straights.

I feel the opposite.. It means more to Rafa than Djoker.. unlike their encounters in previous years on the hardcourts,, Rafa is the Hunter.. He knows he has a chance to improve his rankings and seeding in the USO

Rafa's seed is set for the USO and barring anything crazy he will almost certainly finish the year ranked at least #2. This is bigger for Nole to keep a stranglehold on the #1 rank and stop the bleeding against Nadal. Nole hasn't come close to winning anything since Monte Carlo too it should be said.

what bleeding? he is the world's number 1.. he has beaten Rafa in 3 of 4 times that have faced each other in GS finals

He has lost 4 of 5 even if they all are on clay. Meanwhile he is near the end of what has to be another very disappointing season so far. This is a huge few weeks for Djokovic and if he destroys Rafa off clay it sets him up well again to have a chance at Paris next year. If he startes losing to Rafa off clay then the opposite happens and the floodgates open. He also has no business losing to Rafa on hards, it is just superior tennis. It would indicate that he is rattled mentally.

 

[DarthFed]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

The ball was still in play! I really can't believe that anyone thinks otherwise.

And as for Rafa pointing at a mark, I don't think he deliberately pointed at the wrong mark, and I'm not certain that it was the wrong mark. It was early in the 3rd - and Nole lost that set 6-1. It hardly influenced the outcome.

Really, get over it. Your guy done well that day. He took Nadal to five...

Yes, Djokovic had barely hit the ball when he hit the net...he just misjudged that. As to the other, I didn't see the 3rd set, but, if it was in that one, Djokovic was on walkabout, anyway, and what would it have changed? Novak was out-played in that match and did well to take it to 5, as Kieran says. He made chances for himself, but duffed them. Same as Nadal in the AO 2012 final. Yes....get over it.

The one in the 3rd set was in the first game on deuce I think. I don't know if Rafa pointed at the wrong mark or Pascal saw it out when it might have been in. Hawkeye showed it clearly in but is not 100% accurate on clay which is why they don't use it.

I think it's a stretch for Herios to blame that whole 3rd set on that call. Djokovic lost the plot that whole set, something that has happened to him a lot the past couple years. As to the 5th set disaster that's just Djokovic being terrible on overheads and not handling the pressure. It caught up with him...

 

[Kieran]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

Good post, Darth!

 

[Riotbeard]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

I think nole takes this in 2 compelling sets but with not too much drama something like 6-4/7-5. I stand by my contentions that Rafa is a real contender at the USO, but I still think he needs to make more adjustments over the next two/three weeks to be competitive against novak, so this one won't be particularly suspenseful. I am looking forward (fingers crossed) to andy and rafa facing off next week. It will tell us about the new Andy, as Rafa and he have not played in over a year I think.

 

[El Dude]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

Rafa's seed is set for the USO and barring anything crazy he will almost certainly finish the year ranked at least #2. This is bigger for Nole to keep a stranglehold on the #1 rank and stop the bleeding against Nadal. Nole hasn't come close to winning anything since Monte Carlo too it should be said.

That's a huge over-statement. Novak came very close to beating Rafa in the French Open, and very well could have done so if he hadn't hit the net. That match could have gone either way, and in Rafa's backyard. And then Novak lost in the Final at Wimbledon. He played the worst match I've seen him play at a Grand Slam in years, but he still made it to the final. So yeah, I disagree that he "hasn't come close to winning anything since Monte Carlo."

That said, I agree that Rafa is closing on him. Rafa's still up by almost 800 points in the Race rankings, and will be ahead no matter what happens today. By the time the WTF rolls around they could be neck and neck. However, I have a hard time imagining Rafa winning WTF. Its probably going to be either Andy or Novak, unless Roger discovers the fountain of youth.

 

[DarthFed]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

Rafa's seed is set for the USO and barring anything crazy he will almost certainly finish the year ranked at least #2. This is bigger for Nole to keep a stranglehold on the #1 rank and stop the bleeding against Nadal. Nole hasn't come close to winning anything since Monte Carlo too it should be said.

That's a huge over-statement. Novak came very close to beating Rafa in the French Open, and very well could have done so if he hadn't hit the net. That match could have gone either way, and in Rafa's backyard. And then Novak lost in the Final at Wimbledon. He played the worst match I've seen him play at a Grand Slam in years, but he still made it to the final. So yeah, I disagree that he "hasn't come close to winning anything since Monte Carlo."

That said, I agree that Rafa is closing on him. Rafa's still up by almost 800 points in the Race rankings, and will be ahead no matter what happens today. By the time the WTF rolls around they could be neck and neck. However, I have a hard time imagining Rafa winning WTF. Its probably going to be either Andy or Novak, unless Roger discovers the fountain of youth.

True, the FO is the one he almost won since that was the real final. My point is he has had another extended streak of poor play by his standards. That's where I say he has to "stop the bleeding" a bit.

 

[El Dude]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

Perhaps we need to stop seeing Novak as struggling because he's not playing like 2011, and just recognize 2011 for what it was: a career year, and one of the half dozen or so best in the Open Era (to go along with a couple of Roger's years, Rafa's 2010, McEnroe's 1984, Borg's 1980, Connors' 1974 and Laver's 1969). 2012-13 Novak is still better than he was in 2010 and before; he's still arguably the best player in the game, or certainly at least one of the three best. But he's not invincible and, I think, is "only" good for 1-2 Slams a year for another 2-3 years. I don't think he'll win 3+ again, not with Rafa healthy and Andy Murray being his equal.

Anything more than 1-2 Slams per year is a lot to ask. I'm predicting he's halfway to his career total, which will be 12, although I can see anything in the 10-14 range.

 

[nehmeth]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

Perhaps we need to stop seeing Novak as struggling because he's not playing like 2011, and just recognize 2011 for what it was: a career year, and one of the half dozen or so best in the Open Era (to go along with a couple of Roger's years, Rafa's 2010, McEnroe's 1984, Borg's 1980, Connors' 1974 and Laver's 1969). 2012-13 Novak is still better than he was in 2010 and before; he's still arguably the best player in the game, or certainly at least one of the three best. But he's not invincible and, I think, is "only" good for 1-2 Slams a year for another 2-3 years. I don't think he'll win 3+ again, not with Rafa healthy and Andy Murray being his equal.

Anything more than 1-2 Slams per year is a lot to ask. I'm predicting he's halfway to his career total, which will be 12, although I can see anything in the 10-14 range.

Well said, Dude.

 

[kskate2]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

Stop it!. Pascal made 2 big errors in that final, both favoring Nadal at critical points in the match. He should have been suspended.

It was a semifinal.

And the ball was still in play when he touched the net!

Crikey, I didn't think Nole fans were swimming so deep in The Nile.... :nono

Sorry, it was a SF indeed.
He touched it, AFTER the double bounce, thus nope, the ball was not in play.
Also he was fooled by Rafa who pointed to a different sign left by the ball calling a ball out, while Nole's ball hit the line.
So, let's leave it at that, because even now it makes me mad when I think about it.

Herios,
We can't leave it at that because your hypothesis is not accurate. I'm not a Nadal or Novak fan but believe the correct calls were made. I mean calling for someone's suspension because your player didn't get the desired result is a little preposterous. The ball was still in play when Novak touched the net and you can watch the replay 100 times and it won't change the reality.

As to the line call, no one can be certain if Nadal pointed to the wrong mark or not. He pointed to the mark he thought was correct. I've never seen Nadal, Fed, Andy or Novak take a point they didn't earn. There is great sportsmanship between the 4.

All that aside, Novak wins this match in 3 sets.

 

[tented]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

In tennis anything is possible, but realistically Rafa barely beat No1e on his favourite clay earlier this year and even that only after being help by Maria (Pascal) and officials so I don't think anyone can expect him to beat No1e on cement.

Come on, Mastoor, you need to let that go. Never forget that 1) Pascal made the correct call, and 2) that was Novak's third or fourth breakpoint anyway. By no means was the match decided on that one point.

However, I do agree that Novak will win today, probably in straight sets, which is what I voted for.

 

[tented]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

I think nole takes this in 2 compelling sets but with not too much drama something like 6-4/7-5. I stand by my contentions that Rafa is a real contender at the USO, but I still think he needs to make more adjustments over the next two/three weeks to be competitive against novak, so this one won't be particularly suspenseful. I am looking forward (fingers crossed) to andy and rafa facing off next week. It will tell us about the new Andy, as Rafa and he have not played in over a year I think.

Sounds right about today, and I'm also looking forward to Rafa/Murray next week.

 

[DarthFed]

RE: Roger's Cup SF - Djokovic v. Nadal

Perhaps we need to stop seeing Novak as struggling because he's not playing like 2011, and just recognize 2011 for what it was: a career year, and one of the half dozen or so best in the Open Era (to go along with a couple of Roger's years, Rafa's 2010, McEnroe's 1984, Borg's 1980, Connors' 1974 and Laver's 1969). 2012-13 Novak is still better than he was in 2010 and before; he's still arguably the best player in the game, or certainly at least one of the three best. But he's not invincible and, I think, is "only" good for 1-2 Slams a year for another 2-3 years. I don't think he'll win 3+ again, not with Rafa healthy and Andy Murray being his equal.

Anything more than 1-2 Slams per year is a lot to ask. I'm predicting he's halfway to his career total, which will be 12, although I can see anything in the 10-14 range.

I don't think anyone except maybe certain hardcore fans thought 2011 was going to be the norm but I'd think that 2012 is undoubtedly seen as a disappointment and 2013 might be heading there. Think back to 2008 for Roger...that was a horrible year by his standards flat out. Novak is a great enough player to have some standards as well... Remember that since AO 2012 he is 2-5 against the other top players in majors. It goes without saying that is very poor.

EDIT: To add to the point, what I'm getting at is that the drop down from 2011 to 2012-2013 has been extreme IMO and he has had chances to do a lot better but hasn't been strong in the big moments.