2025 ATP General News

[El Dude]

Novak's had a weird year. He lost in the SF of his last four tournaments, and went out in the SF of all four Slams. He's only won an ATP 250, but has gone deep in most tournaments and is probably already a lock for the year-end top 5 (he's #3 in the race). On one hand, he's a shadow of his former self; on the other, it is amazing how good he still is, given his age.

 

[Fiero425]

Novak's had a weird year. He lost in the SF of his last four tournaments, and went out in the SF of all four Slams. He's only won an ATP 250, but has gone deep in most tournaments and is probably already a lock for the year-end top 5 (he's #3 in the race). On one hand, he's a shadow of his former self; on the other, it is amazing how good he still is, given his age.

Nole's been amazing considering his lack of competing for the most part this season! IMO the accolades have been restrained considering his success! Roger was nowhere near this effective at 38, struggling to get out of the early rounds of Wimbledon! The Big 3 all fell off at 36 yrs. old, but Novak is accomplishing something every time he goes out there to play; extending a record he already owns or surpassing Fedal! No one thought that Olympic GM could be had, but he not only won it last season, he didn't lose a set against the latest NG'rs! He's done more in the last 5 yrs. than most players who've playing for almost 2 decades! I just can't get over the #'s whenever I check the record bks.! He just about owns it all!

 

[PhiEaglesfan712]

Nole's been amazing considering his lack of competing for the most part this season! IMO the accolades have been restrained considering his success! Roger was nowhere near this effective at 38, struggling to get out of the early rounds of Wimbledon! The Big 3 all fell off at 36 yrs. old, but Novak is accomplishing something every time he goes out there to play; extending a record he already owns or surpassing Fedal! No one thought that Olympic GM could be had, but he not only won it last season, he didn't lose a set against the latest NG'rs! He's done more in the last 5 yrs. than most players who've playing for almost 2 decades! I just can't get over the #'s whenever I check the record bks.! He just about owns it all!

Roger had one of his most impressive runs at Wimbledon in 2019. He was competitive against a still prime Djokovic. Roger had match point against Novak at Wimbledon in 2019, and beat him convincingly later in the Tour Finals. Novak is lucky that Roger suffered an injury in the previous round of the 2020 AO. I could make the argument that if not for the injury, Roger might have had the upper hand against Novak. And it's not like Novak was unbeatable. Dominic Thiem took Novak to 5 sets in the final.

Roger fell off when he returned in 2021, but he was past his 39th birthday at that point. There was no Wimbledon in 2020, so Roger struggled to get out of the early rounds of Wimbledon in 2021, when he was nearing his 40th birthday. Still, Roger made the quarterfinal.

Roger 38 (2019): 53-10 (4 titles, #3 ranking)
Novak 38 (2025): 35-11 (1 title, currently #3 in ATP race)

To me, the difference between Roger and Novak at 38 is that Roger was still putting the finishing touches on tournaments and not losing to qualifiers/players ranked outside the Top 100.

Also, I think Rafa's last truly great season was 2019. He went 58-7 that year. He never 40 matches in a season after that (although 2020 was a COVID shortened season, and he won the French Open that year), going 27-7 in 2020, 24-5 in 2021, and 39-8 in 2022. Rafa's 2019-20 was his equivalent to Roger's 2017-18. You could start to see the slippage as early as 2021. He lost to Lloyd Harris at the Citi Open. Rafa had a bounce back year in 2022, and that's probably his equivalent to Roger's 2019 or Novak's 2024-25. Rafa's early season was great in 2022, but he clearly wasn't the same player after Indian Wells. While Rafa won the French Open, he struggled during the run (he almost lost to FAA and then got a lucky break with Zverev's injury because that one was likely going to be a 6-hour, 5-set marathon), and had an uncharacteristically poor clay season leading up to the FO. People forget, but Nadal wasn't even betting the favorite heading into the 2022 French Open.

 

[El Dude]

^The above sort of illustrates the difference between title results and overall playing level. We can illustrate this further by imagining two different Slam results:

A: W, 1R, 1R, 1R
B: SF, SF, SF, SF

There's not a player in the world who would prefer the B results, but it implies better overall play - and is reflected by ATP points (3200 vs 2030).

All of which is to say that I do agree that there's a difference in the overall level of Rafa in 2019 vs 2022; Rafa was a better player in 2019 than 2022, but in some ways 2022 was more impressive. In a way, 2022 illustrates Rafa's greatness as much as any season in that he still managed to pull out two Slam titles. At the AO, he beat Medvedev at his very best, and a healthy Berrettini. At RG, he still managed to have a dominant tournament, despite a five-setter with FAA. He found a way.

You can also see this in his Elo Rating:

If you look closely, he reached his highest Elo in 2019 since early 2014, the tail-end of Rafa's prime. There is a downturn after that until the end of 2021, then spikes as he won the AO and RG, then a collapse after (mainly due to not playing). Rafa's always been up and down, and you can literally see the clay seasons as sharp peaks.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Paris Masters 1000 Director Cedric Pioline says they've slowed the surface compared to last year to be the closer possible to the ATP Finals conditions

source @carolebouchard.bs.by.social.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Jannik Sinner has squashed claims he will not play Paris Masters or DC this year, speaking at the Six Kings Slams, he feels good physically and mentally, had 2 days off after he was forced to retire in Shanghai, he is looking forward to the up coming tournaments Vienna, Paris, Turin and DC and hopes to finish the year well.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Just watching Fonseca v Botic in Brussels
Fonseca could have had a double break in the 1st set, put in a poor service game and was broken to love, back on serve in the 1st set 4 games all.
Fonseca will now serve to force a TB for the 1st set 5-6.
On his 6 SP Botic wins the 1st set 75, Fonseca had his chances, his serve at times let him down, ufe at the wrong time in his last service game cost him
I lost my stream in the 2nd set, just got it back now to see Fonseca serve for the 2nd set at 5-3
I think I jinxed Fonseca on SP his shot went long back on serve in the 2nd set 5all!
Shades of the 1st set, Fonseca will serve to force a TB in the 2nd set!
TB it is for the 2nd set!
Botic playing a great TB, leading 5-1
Well done Botic defeating Fonseca 75 76(2)
Fonseca was 4-2 and BPs in the 1st set
Fonseca 5-3 SP in the 2nd set, hmmm he lost this match in straight sets.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

I was reading a really interesting article from fitness expert Stephen Smith, he explained how difficult it is to find a balance for older athletes, for example 38 yo Novak Djokovic, who was struggling with many different injury concerns in the Shanghai tournament.
Stephen Smith explained,
"Contrary to what most people think, too much rest and too much inactivity can have a negative impact. You have to find the perfect balance between rest and the right amount of stimulation, otherwise risk of injury increases".

 

[Moxie]

Novak's had a weird year. He lost in the SF of his last four tournaments, and went out in the SF of all four Slams. He's only won an ATP 250, but has gone deep in most tournaments and is probably already a lock for the year-end top 5 (he's #3 in the race). On one hand, he's a shadow of his former self; on the other, it is amazing how good he still is, given his age.

^The above sort of illustrates the difference between title results and overall playing level. We can illustrate this further by imagining two different Slam results:

A: W, 1R, 1R, 1R
B: SF, SF, SF, SF

There's not a player in the world who would prefer the B results, but it implies better overall play - and is reflected by ATP points (3200 vs 2030).

All of which is to say that I do agree that there's a difference in the overall level of Rafa in 2019 vs 2022; Rafa was a better player in 2019 than 2022, but in some ways 2022 was more impressive. In a way, 2022 illustrates Rafa's greatness as much as any season in that he still managed to pull out two Slam titles. At the AO, he beat Medvedev at his very best, and a healthy Berrettini. At RG, he still managed to have a dominant tournament, despite a five-setter with FAA. He found a way.

You can also see this in his Elo Rating:

View attachment 10305
If you look closely, he reached his highest Elo in 2019 since early 2014, the tail-end of Rafa's prime. There is a downturn after that until the end of 2021, then spikes as he won the AO and RG, then a collapse after (mainly due to not playing). Rafa's always been up and down, and you can literally see the clay seasons as sharp peaks.

I couldn't decide which of these post to reply, so I replied to both.

The Big 3 have been amazing, in their own ways, and they continued to show up the players behind them. In different ways of falling off, maybe, but not dissimilar, in others.

Novak is very fit, which is his late-career super-power. Not to take away from the talent, which is his real super-power. But eventually, age wins. And if you have two players who have surpassed you, you hit the glass ceiling, at the majors. Or your own body does you in, as it did for him in Shanghai.

I'll be curious to see how Novak does in the YEC and in the AO. Pretty soon, he's going to want a big win, right? If not, how much longer is a SF going to do it for him?

 

[Jelenafan]

I couldn't decide which of these post to reply, so I replied to both.

The Big 3 have been amazing, in their own ways, and they continued to show up the players behind them. In different ways of falling off, maybe, but not dissimilar, in others.

Novak is very fit, which is his late-career super-power. Not to take away from the talent, which is his real super-power. But eventually, age wins. And if you have two players who have surpassed you, you hit the glass ceiling, at the majors. Or your own body does you in, as it did for him in Shanghai.

I'll be curious to see how Novak does in the YEC and in the AO. Pretty soon, he's going to want a big win, right? If not, how much longer is a SF going to do it for him?

and the ocean is wet…

 

[Moxie]

and the ocean is wet…

Well, OK, forgive me for stating the obvious, but it's sort of easy to wonder, with Novak.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

BTW,
The two groups of 2025 ATP Finals will be named after Jimmy Connors and Bjorn Borg, with Alcaraz heading the Connors group and Sinner the Borg group.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Fritz halfway from beating Zverev again, 6-3 in the 1st set of the Six Kings Slams, which is being streamed live via netflix
Fritz defeats Zverev 63 64 to reach the semi finals, this is the seventh consecutive win for Fritz over Zverev ( though this one doesnt count for the official records) Umpire Carlos Ramos comes out of retirement, to chair the match btw.
Fritz will play Alcaraz tomorrow in the SFs

 

[El Dude]

I couldn't decide which of these post to reply, so I replied to both.

The Big 3 have been amazing, in their own ways, and they continued to show up the players behind them. In different ways of falling off, maybe, but not dissimilar, in others.

Novak is very fit, which is his late-career super-power. Not to take away from the talent, which is his real super-power. But eventually, age wins. And if you have two players who have surpassed you, you hit the glass ceiling, at the majors. Or your own body does you in, as it did for him in Shanghai.

I'll be curious to see how Novak does in the YEC and in the AO. Pretty soon, he's going to want a big win, right? If not, how much longer is a SF going to do it for him?

Actually, given the last 8ish years, I don't think it is overly obvious to say that "eventually, age wins." With all of the Big Three, we've had moments where age itself was in doubt. No one expected Roger's resurgence in 2017 at age 35-36, then remaining an elite player or a couple more seasons through 2019 when he turned 38. Rafa's trajectory from 2019 to 2021 was down, then he won the first two Slams of 2022 at age 35-36. Novak had 2023 when he was 35-36. At that point, given how dominant 2023 wasy, I think we were all wondering how long he could hold back Father Time.

But, in the end, all three dropped off after turning 36, to varying degrees. But for a moment for each, it seemed like they could go on indefinitely.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Defending champion Jannik Sinner defeats Tsitsipas 62 63 to reach the SFs at the Six Kings Slam and will play Djokovic in the semi finals

 

[mrzz]

I don't think it is overly obvious to say that "eventually, age wins.

Actually, this is not even an absolute truth. You can always be hit by a concrete mixer truck.

 

[Jelenafan]

Actually, given the last 8ish years, I don't think it is overly obvious to say that "eventually, age wins." With all of the Big Three, we've had moments where age itself was in doubt. No one expected Roger's resurgence in 2017 at age 35-36, then remaining an elite player or a couple more seasons through 2019 when he turned 38. Rafa's trajectory from 2019 to 2021 was down, then he won the first two Slams of 2022 at age 35-36. Novak had 2023 when he was 35-36. At that point, given how dominant 2023 wasy, I think we were all wondering how long he could hold back Father Time.

But, in the end, all three dropped off after turning 36, to varying degrees. But for a moment for each, it seemed like they could go on indefinitely.

Pulease, ageless wonders did not start with the big 3 in the Open era.

Aussie Ken Rosewall made the finals of Wimbledon & US Open at the age of 39, was ranked YE top ten at the age of 40, and at age 42 was still ranked top 20, at age 42 he beat the #3 ranked player in the world ( Vitas Gerulatis) and won his last tournaments at age 43! At age 46 still managed to beat a top 50 player.

The great Pancho Gonzalez was at age 41 the highest earning American player , and at age 40 beat the defending French Open champion at Roland Garros.

At age 41 ((!) he could still occasionally beat the # 1 player, Rod Laver in the Rocket’s Grand Slam year

As a 43 year old serve & volleyer he beat 19 year old Jimmy Connors & was winning tourney just shy of his 44th birthday., and even at 44 & 45 could make deep runs at tourneys beating top 20 players.

 

[El Dude]

Pulease, ageless wonders did not start with the big 3 in the Open era.

Aussie Ken Rosewall made the finals of Wimbledon & US Open at the age of 39, was ranked YE top ten at the age of 40, and at age 42 was still ranked top 20, at age 42 he beat the #3 ranked player in the world ( Vitas Gerulatis) and won his last tournaments at age 43! At age 46 still managed to beat a top 50 player.

The great Pancho Gonzalez was at age 41 the highest earning American player , and at age 40 beat the defending French Open champion at Roland Garros.

At age 41 ((!) he could still occasionally beat the # 1 player, Rod Laver in the Rocket’s Grand Slam year

As a 43 year old serve & volleyer he beat 19 year old Jimmy Connors & was winning tourney just shy of his 44th birthday., and even at 44 & 45 could make deep runs at tourneys beating top 20 players.

Did I say they did? But...none of those players were the best player on tour on their 36th birthdays. That was my point - the symmetry of it.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

The International Tennis Federation (ITF) will become "World Tennis" in 2026, following an overwhelming majority vote from its member national tennis associations in favour of the proposal at ITF Annual General Meeting today.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Carlos Alcaraz with a 'clinical performance' 64 62 over Taylor Fritz is back into the finals of the Six Kings Slam! Alcaraz 6 Aces, 30 W, 8 UFE.
BTW Shaquille O'Neal in the house for Alcaraz v Fritz.