2014 Aussie Open SF: Fedal Volume 33

[Murat Baslamisli]

Rafa played great today. I don't think Roger did. Rafa was a part of the reason. Roger himself was part of the reason as well. I am not understanding folks who think this is the best Roger can do against Rafa.

You can chalk me up as one of those people. Federer did not play below his usual standard today. He hit a number of excellent shots. He showed up to play and came in ready.

The problem is that his strategy is so fundamentally flawed, based on what the match-up requires, that he simply cannot beat Nadal playing that way.

I have seen Roger bagel Rafa , where even Rafa said when Roger plays like this, he is unplayable no matter how good HE plays.

Back when the series didn't have such a lopsided slant and the attitude of both players was entirely different.

Rafa obviously has the advantage in this match -up for many reasons, but I am not sure if today's loss was because of match-up issues.

It was match-up issues, especially considering that Federer's CC forehand does very little damage against Nadal's backhand. Their games don't mesh well for Federer.

I actually liked Roger's backhand 10 times more than his forehand today.

Then, if I may ask, what were you smoking during the match?

Did you like how Fed's backhand gave you two winners for the match? Did you like how Nadal pounded it to take control of numerous rallies?

It was too early to smoke, but I have seen Roger return almost %90 with drive backhands as opposed to chips and I have seen Roger's backhand keep him in a lot of rallies only to lose them with his forehand breaking down. Listen, I do not expect Roger to hit countless winners with his backhand in a match against Rafa, but I DO expect his forehand to do it. It did not. Simple really.

 

[calitennis127]

It was too early to smoke, but I have seen Roger return almost %90 with drive backhands as opposed to chips and I have seen Roger's backhand keep him in a lot of rallies only to lose them with his forehand breaking down.

Lol....those were rallies in which Nadal had Federer on a string and pounded his backhand mercilessly. The fact that Nadal changed direction and went to Fed's forehand and Fed missed a FH on the run is not something you should find surprising.

Listen, I do not expect Roger to hit countless winners with his backhand in a match against Rafa, but I DO expect his forehand to do it. It did not. Simple really.

Well, you will get some winners, but not nearly as much as there could be if Federer worked Nadal's forehand side more than he does.

 

[Front242]

I have seen Roger bagel Rafa , where even Rafa said when Roger plays like this, he is unplayable no matter how good HE plays.

Back when the series didn't have such a lopsided slant and the attitude of both players was entirely different.

Actually, Rafa has been in Roger's head for years and still got bagelled at the 2011 WTF when Roger was years past his prime. For your viewing pleasure. Plenty of good shotmaking and only 2 sets so stamina clearly wasn't an issue.


[video=youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=yjwaygk40LM[/video]

 

[calitennis127]

I have seen Roger bagel Rafa , where even Rafa said when Roger plays like this, he is unplayable no matter how good HE plays.

Back when the series didn't have such a lopsided slant and the attitude of both players was entirely different.

Actually, Rafa has been in Roger's head for years and still got bagelled at the 2011 WTF when Roger was years past his prime. For your viewing pleasure. Plenty of good shotmaking and only 2 sets so stamina clearly wasn't an issue.


[video=youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=yjwaygk40LM[/video]

That is Nadal's worst court on tour by far, and also their series was different back then. Nadal was firmly in control, but it wasn't as bad as it is now.

 

[Front242]

So what, you could say the same about clay for Roger. That's a large reason why the h2h is the way it is.

 

[calitennis127]

So what, you could say the same about clay for Roger. That's a large reason why the h2h is the way it is.

Federer's game is much more suited for clay than Nadal's is for the O2 court. Please.

Federer should have won a number of those clay matches and he didn't, for many of the same reasons that he lost today.

 

[Front242]

So what, you could say the same about clay for Roger. That's a large reason why the h2h is the way it is.

Federer's game is much more suited for clay than Nadal's is for the O2 court. Please.

Federer should have won a number of those clay matches and he didn't, for many of the same reasons that he lost today.

So why all the Nadal fan hype about him potentially winning the WTF last year? He can't be that bad. Simply saying, take all the clay wins in Nadal's favour out of the equation and that h2h doesn't look anywhere near as bad.

 

[Murat Baslamisli]

Cali, all I am saying is this was not vintage Federer, and we might not even see vintage Federer ever again. I am fully aware of the match-up issues and I have discussed them on these boards a million times. But sometimes it is not all about the match-up. Because if it was ALL about the match-up, Roger would have not won 10 matches. Clearly, every 2.5 matches or so, statistically speaking, Roger was able to overcome all the match up issues and win, even a couple on clay. So, how does he do it? Not like today.

 

[imjimmy]

It never ceases to amaze me how comfortable Nadal usually feels against Federer. Heck, he looked awful playing against Nishikori and Dimitrov, but today against Federer, totally different story. I think the 2nd set was really the first time he truly started opening his shoulders. I was dismayed to see how defensive he was for his last 2 matches. His forehand lacked penetration - just had too much spin and awful court positioning. Today he finally started striking the ball with purpose and used his off-forehand and backhand offensively.

Overall, this is an awful matchup for Federer. Something like how Nadal feels against Djokovic. How different is the Nadal-Djoko and Nadal-Fed matchup. Rafa is on the edge almost every single point when playing against Novak. He has to consistently redline his game to keep Djokovic at bay. Against Federer, however, Nadal can play well within himself. What's more, once Rafa starts to loosen up (as he did in the 2nd set) he can just pull away.

Good victory for Rafa. I think Stan would be harder to contend with, but I would be surprised if the Swiss actually produced the upset.

Finally Fed's fans comments notwithstanding, I think this was a great tournament for Fed. His level against Tsonga and Murray was very encouraging. I think he could do a lot of damage on the faster courts and grass. And provided he doesn't have to contend with Nadal, he might even be able to win them with a little bit of luck.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Roger is gonna regret not taking his bh dtl , I think Stan will unload on his bh dtl..I thought Fed played excellent the 1st set .Rafa just broke his will and just have the perfect game to defeat Fed ,

I hope you're kidding.

Relying on his backhand as a primary weapon is an insane idea.

Dude, dont get it twisted..I said Fed should have some cuts and directed his bh dtl instead of cc

 

[19USC66]

From late 2011 to Cincinnati 2012 Roger Federer was the the best player in the world his number of top ten victories verify this fact. However, the 2014 version was not going to beat Rafa Nadal. His level today is about where he is in the top ten. He is simply not good enough and in reality that isn't too bad. For Fed fans and I am one to continue to recall 2003-2007 and expect vintage Federer to return. It ain't happening.

I have always felt Fed was the greatest tennis player of all time. Yet, Nadal is the greatest ATP tournament player of all time. For those of us who play this silly game? After a quick thought to muddle over my somewhat contradictory statement. Tennis players will understand what I mean. Nadal when he leaves the sport will be labled the GOAT. Until someone else comes along. Nevertheless, Stan has a chance. Slim, but a chance.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Roger is gonna regret not taking his bh dtl , I think Stan will unload on his bh dtl..I thought Fed played excellent the 1st set .Rafa just broke his will and just have the perfect game to defeat Fed ,

I hope you're kidding.

Relying on his backhand as a primary weapon is an insane idea.

I agree, Roger has to do it with his serve and forehand against Rafa and both were awful.

Darth, As usual Cali got it twisted ..I said he should have some cuts and directed his bh dtl instead of cc ..

 

[Front242]

From late 2011 to Cincinnati 2012 Roger Federer was the the best player in the world his number of top ten victories verify this fact. However, the 2014 version was not going to beat Rafa Nadal. His level today is about where he is in the top ten. He is simply not good enough and in reality that isn't too bad. For Fed fans and I am one to continue to recall 2003-2007 and expect vintage Federer to return. It ain't happening.

I have always felt Fed was the greatest tennis player of all time. Yet, Nadal is the greatest ATP tournament player of all time. For those of us who play this silly game? After a quick thought to muddle over my somewhat contradictory statement. Tennis players will understand what I mean. Nadal when he leaves the sport will be labled the GOAT. Until someone else comes along. Nevertheless, Stan has a chance. Slim, but a chance.

Nah. Stan will never be considered the GOAT Trust me on that

 

[the AntiPusher]

Cali his forehand and serve were awful, the forehand missing left and right and on serve he basically used two second serves for God knows what reason

There's your typical hyperbole.

Fed was hitting clean for the most part. He had his shanks once he lost the first set and got deflated, but calling his forehand awful is absurd.

The problem is what he looking to do with it. If he wants to continue to pound Rafa's backhand, then he can finish his career 10-30 against Nadal. I hope he enjoys himself.

It is not hyperbole at all, he was missing his forehand badly and it got to the point where he was putting nothing on it. The problem is he loses confidence in the forehand too easily these days. As soon as he misses a few he starts pushing them back in and that will never work against Nadal. Wouldn't work against any top player really. He is never beating Nadal with the backhand. That should be obvious to anyone.

Federer has to defy conventionality against Nadal and look to go forehand to forehand. The shots are there. It just takes an extreme commitment to that pattern.

But Nadal fans don't have to worry - the likelihood of that happening is very slim.

You dont know what you are talking about.. If thar was an option surely Roger and all his great coaches and advisers would have to attack Rafa fh with his Fh.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

I hereby resolve that with immediate effect, I will never ever watch another Fedal match
with the expectation that Fed will win. cry:cry

What a disappointing night? Not only he lost, he played well only for the first half of
first set. He actually played bettter in Cincinnattti last year as he played there well
for one and half set. cry:cry

I thought rejunevated Fed will help, thought healed back will help, thought Edberge
will help, thought faster courts will help, thought blisters will aid. Nothing helped
finally.

But, I am confident that performance of Fed in 2014 will be better than that of 2013
based on his wins over Tsonga and Murray. But, being better than Fed'13 is trivial as
Fed'13 was miserable.

Baby Fed could not beat Nadal. Now, Papa Fed also could not beat.

Swiss #2 could not beat Nadal; Let us see whether Swiss #1 could beat Nadal.

Go STAN, STAN the Man.

On the positive side, I can get regular sleep from now on. I don't care to watch
any of the remaining matches live at night 3.30.

 

[Murat Baslamisli]

By the way, congrats to Isabelle, the only person that got the score right.

 

[Front242]

I hereby resolve that with immediate effect, I will never ever watch another Fedal match
with the expectation that Fed will win. cry:cry

What a disappointing night? Not only he lost, he played well only for the first half of
first set. He actually played bettter in Cincinnattti last year as he played there well
for one and half set. cry:cry

I thought rejunevated Fed will help, thought healed back will help, thought Edberge
will help, thought faster courts will help, thought blisters will aid. Nothing helped
finally.

But, I am confident that performance of Fed in 2014 will be better than that of 2013
based on his wins over Tsonga and Murray. But, being better than Fed'13 is trivial as
Fed'13 was miserable.

Baby Fed could not beat Nadal. Now, Papa Fed also could not beat.

Swiss #2 could not beat Nadal; Let us see whether Swiss #1 could beat Nadal.

Go STAN, STAN the Man.

On the positive side, I can get regular sleep from now on. I don't care to watch
any of the remaining matches live at night 3.30.

I'm actually much more looking forward to the women's final than the men's. Reckon it'll be much more exciting. Re Fed, he's so far had a much better start to this year than I expected even with today's loss. Agree on his level at Cincy. That was almost vintage Fed till 4-4 second set but hardcore Nadal fans would probably claim Fed was just as good today eventhough clearly he was not.

 

[Front242]

By the way, congrats to Isabelle, the only person that got the score right.

Haha, that was mostly based on complete dislike of the old guy I'd imagine but either way it was correct. I think she votes Nadal in straight sets every time they play.

 

[crystalfire]

Wow. Couldn't even get a set. Every single time I think fed has a chance against rafa I'm always disappointed. That's it I'm done. I doubt fed will ever beat him again. I feel like rafa can play with one hand and still manage to win. This is just ridiculous. Even dimitrov and nishikori played him tough. Ughhhh

 

[Front242]

Wow. Couldn't even get a set. Every single time I think fed has a chance against rafa I'm always disappointed. That's it I'm done. I doubt fed will ever beat him again. I feel like rafa can play with one hand and still manage to win. This is just ridiculous. Even dimitrov and nishikori played him tough. Ughhhh

His form leading up to today was definitely good enough to manage at least a set so yeah that was utterly disappointing. In fairness though, Rafa was garbage against Nishikori and Dimitrov and clearly played his best match of the tournament today. The amount of shanks and DFs against Dimitrov was very high by Nadal's standard and it seems the different bandage they used today helped him a lot as his play didn't appear affected at all unlike prior matches.