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[Jonathan Northrop] Houston We Have a Problem: The State of American Men's Tennis
- Thread starter El Dude
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Correspondent Kiu
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RE: [Blog] Houston We Have a Problem: The State of American Men's Tennis
Big John is coming along. He is not too shabby at #14
He'll be top 10 soon.
Big John is coming along. He is not too shabby at #14
He'll be top 10 soon.
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RE: [Blog] Houston We Have a Problem: The State of American Men's Tennis
Kieran, I don't think it will. I don't feel particularly aligned with my nation in this regard - I'm more "world-centric" than nationalistic - but it would still be nice to feel more life in the tennis world here.
Kiu, Isner has been #9 before. I don't think he has the overall game to be more than in the #8-12 range at his very best, which certainly is very good - just not elite. Also, he's 28 so won't get any better.
Kieran, I don't think it will. I don't feel particularly aligned with my nation in this regard - I'm more "world-centric" than nationalistic - but it would still be nice to feel more life in the tennis world here.
Kiu, Isner has been #9 before. I don't think he has the overall game to be more than in the #8-12 range at his very best, which certainly is very good - just not elite. Also, he's 28 so won't get any better.
britbox
Multiple Major Winner
RE: [Blog] Houston We Have a Problem: The State of American Men's Tennis
The chart you plotted speaks volumes. It's also worth considering that the US isn't the only powerhouse to fall on hard times. Sweden and Australia spring to mind - both have far smaller populations though.
Some if it's to be expected with the globalisation of the sport, but the US is definitely punching way below it's weight right now.
The chart you plotted speaks volumes. It's also worth considering that the US isn't the only powerhouse to fall on hard times. Sweden and Australia spring to mind - both have far smaller populations though.
Some if it's to be expected with the globalisation of the sport, but the US is definitely punching way below it's weight right now.
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RE: [Blog] Houston We Have a Problem: The State of American Men's Tennis
One of the factos that came to mind as I was writing this, but didn't include because I didn't want to do the research, is that I wonder how the "Iron Curtain" coming down impacted tennis. I think that, coupled with globalization as a whole, could have increased the pool size. But I think it also has to do with the rise of basketball in popularity, and the simple fact that tennis is possibly not even a top five sport in the US - its certainly less popular than (American) football, baseball, basketball, golf, maybe hockey, and now soccer. So that would make it 7th at most!
One of the factos that came to mind as I was writing this, but didn't include because I didn't want to do the research, is that I wonder how the "Iron Curtain" coming down impacted tennis. I think that, coupled with globalization as a whole, could have increased the pool size. But I think it also has to do with the rise of basketball in popularity, and the simple fact that tennis is possibly not even a top five sport in the US - its certainly less popular than (American) football, baseball, basketball, golf, maybe hockey, and now soccer. So that would make it 7th at most!
britbox
Multiple Major Winner
RE: [Blog] Houston We Have a Problem: The State of American Men's Tennis
I'm not sure about basketball - if you look at the best basketball players of the last decade and the best tennis players, I doubt there is that much of a crossover where participants have ever really chose one over the other. I believe Isner played a bit of basketball but can't imagine him in the NBA. Other than that, I'm not sure from a participant viewpoint that it would make much impact.
Perhaps social factors come into it... The big 3 sports in the US aren't really that global, so it difficult to compare how the US stacks up against other countries worldwide. Tennis is much more of a global sport than American Football so you can draw a lot more comparisons with other countries.
I'm not sure about basketball - if you look at the best basketball players of the last decade and the best tennis players, I doubt there is that much of a crossover where participants have ever really chose one over the other. I believe Isner played a bit of basketball but can't imagine him in the NBA. Other than that, I'm not sure from a participant viewpoint that it would make much impact.
Perhaps social factors come into it... The big 3 sports in the US aren't really that global, so it difficult to compare how the US stacks up against other countries worldwide. Tennis is much more of a global sport than American Football so you can draw a lot more comparisons with other countries.
Riotbeard
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RE: [Blog] Houston We Have a Problem: The State of American Men's Tennis
I do think we have a problem, but I think a considerable part of it is the increasing amount of countries with significant tennis cultures. This doesn't mean that we aren't in decline, but 41 members of the top 100 seems to me to be as much about a smaller pool of countries than no talent. I think we are in crisis, but a return to 70s style U.S. dominance is impossible for any country in the future without a significant sea change in the number of notable tennis countries. I think what we have seen in recent years with Spain is about as good as it can get for a single country (which the U.S. is far cry from no doubt).
I do think we have a problem, but I think a considerable part of it is the increasing amount of countries with significant tennis cultures. This doesn't mean that we aren't in decline, but 41 members of the top 100 seems to me to be as much about a smaller pool of countries than no talent. I think we are in crisis, but a return to 70s style U.S. dominance is impossible for any country in the future without a significant sea change in the number of notable tennis countries. I think what we have seen in recent years with Spain is about as good as it can get for a single country (which the U.S. is far cry from no doubt).
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RE: [Blog] Houston We Have a Problem: The State of American Men's Tennis
Riotbeard, I think there are two levels to this - the depth of players (as represented by number of Americans in the top 100 and 50) and the quality (as represented by number in top 20 and 10). The the decline of depth makes more sense with regards to the broader international pool, but what is particularly disturbing is that US hasn't produced a Slam winner since Andy Roddick, and a multi-Slam winner since Courier, Agassi, and Sampras.
Of course all-time greats don't grow on trees, and since Sampras and Agassi there have only been three or four (depending on if you count Murray), but what is different now is that for the first time in Open Era history - there hasn't been an all-time American great playing (since Agassi retired in 2006), or a near-elite American (since Roddick declined and retired). As far as I can tell, for the entire span of Open Era history the baton has been passed, until recent years.
Actually, this just gave me an idea for another chart!
Riotbeard, I think there are two levels to this - the depth of players (as represented by number of Americans in the top 100 and 50) and the quality (as represented by number in top 20 and 10). The the decline of depth makes more sense with regards to the broader international pool, but what is particularly disturbing is that US hasn't produced a Slam winner since Andy Roddick, and a multi-Slam winner since Courier, Agassi, and Sampras.
Of course all-time greats don't grow on trees, and since Sampras and Agassi there have only been three or four (depending on if you count Murray), but what is different now is that for the first time in Open Era history - there hasn't been an all-time American great playing (since Agassi retired in 2006), or a near-elite American (since Roddick declined and retired). As far as I can tell, for the entire span of Open Era history the baton has been passed, until recent years.
Actually, this just gave me an idea for another chart!
nehmeth
Grand Slam Champion
RE: [Blog] Houston We Have a Problem: The State of American Men's Tennis
E.D. Thank you for putting up the chart.
Australia and the United States were the tennis powers for many years. Both have fallen on hard times.
You made one small comment about the Iron Curtain. There are a lot of young players who've come up within the eastern bloc, maybe not the level of a Lendl or Djokovic, but they're extremely motivated to win and do well.
For over a decade, Spain and France continue to have good representation. Quite admirable.
E.D. Thank you for putting up the chart.
Australia and the United States were the tennis powers for many years. Both have fallen on hard times.
You made one small comment about the Iron Curtain. There are a lot of young players who've come up within the eastern bloc, maybe not the level of a Lendl or Djokovic, but they're extremely motivated to win and do well.
For over a decade, Spain and France continue to have good representation. Quite admirable.