Brussels hit by extremists... more deaths

[britbox]

 

[britbox]

There was a lot of security alerts going on with Brussels a couple of months ago... when the Davis Cup was going on... i.e. attack imminent. Unfortunately, I guess this is it.

 

[Federberg]

Terrible events! Europe needs to get it's act together. I find it hard to believe that the intelligence services in the UK would be compromised like this. I'm not sure what the solution is, but some sort of coordinated intelligence services is logical given the open borders. It seems like gross dereliction for that not to be in place already

 

[britbox]

Terrible events! Europe needs to get it's act together. I find it hard to believe that the intelligence services in the UK would be compromised like this. I'm not sure what the solution is, but some sort of coordinated intelligence services is logical given the open borders. It seems like gross dereliction for that not to be in place already

I dunno Fberg, it's pretty hard to defend against... we took some hits on the chin with the IRA bombings over a number of years... I agree about co-ordinated intelliegence, but maybe there is something in place already? I don't know.

 

[Federberg]

Maybe, but the fact that neither you or I know of it is a concern. The only supra-national body I can think of is Interpol. Europe needs it's own FBI. It just seems to me these folks in Brussels are keen to take our cash for goodness knows what, but when stuff like this is happening in France and Belgium, it's the police and/or intelligence services in those countries dealing with the problem. That's not good enough in this terrible new world we live in. It feels like these sickos are laughing at us.

 

[britbox]

Maybe, but the fact that neither you or I know of it is a concern. The only supra-national body I can think of is Interpol. Europe needs it's own FBI. It just seems to me these folks in Brussels are keen to take our cash for goodness knows what, but when stuff like this is happening in France and Belgium, it's the police and/or intelligence services in those countries dealing with the problem. That's not good enough in this terrible new world we live in. It feels like these sickos are laughing at us.

Yes, and I confess I'm not a fan of a political EU federal system. I'd rather the UK stayed out and just limited the relationship to trade.

Agree that if one isn't already in place (and like you, I don't know of one existing) then a Pan-European security agency should be in place.

 

[DarthFed]

Sometimes the intelligence just drops the ball. Just look at the case in the US with the guy who went to Saudi Arabia and brought back a mail-order bride and then collected enough weapons and ammunition to supply a small army. That was extremely preventable.

Without knowing the full details yet we can't speculate on how preventable this was. Either way it is a tragedy.

 

[Federberg]

That's a fair point Twisted, but what we're seeing in Europe doesn't have the same feel of a random act of lone jihadists. This thing today.. 2 separate coordinated attacks. That's too big to give the security services a pass

 

[DarthFed]

Agreed. Europe is just...too open and I know how bad that statement sounds on the surface as far as the immigration issues. In Europe I'd be more afraid of terrorism than in the US right now and it feels a little surprising to think/type it but there it is. In the US we have to be more afraid of random homegrown idiots with 100 guns shooting up a place for no reason.

 

[britbox]

Agree twisted - the bigger concerns for the US are the crazies within over the terrorists on the outside.

 

[isabelle]

sad for our Belgian friends, they didn't deserve such a bad day. pray for them

 

[Asmodeus]

Unfortunately, there is nothing Europe can do. Europe is a moribund continent. All the great cultures of Europe will go the way of the dodo bird. The truth needs to set you free. Don't come to the states, though. We're running out of room and will likely suffer an economic collapse in the next decade or so. You'll just have to accept your impending death like good little sheep. Now, if you don't like this and want to fight, then. . . . . .

 

[calitennis127]

Maybe, but the fact that neither you or I know of it is a concern. The only supra-national body I can think of is Interpol. Europe needs it's own FBI. It just seems to me these folks in Brussels are keen to take our cash for goodness knows what, but when stuff like this is happening in France and Belgium, it's the police and/or intelligence services in those countries dealing with the problem. That's not good enough in this terrible new world we live in. It feels like these sickos are laughing at us.

They are laughing at us. They cite Muhammad's example and then quote Islamic texts before carrying out these attacks, and then non-Muslims like you tell them that they aren't Islamic.

Apparently small-government Federberg wants European governments to form all-out police states so that they can enjoy the cultural enrichment of Islamic immigration. Small price to pay I guess.

 

[Federberg]

They are laughing at us. They cite Muhammad's example and then quote Islamic texts before carrying out these attacks, and then non-Muslims like you tell them that they aren't Islamic.

Apparently small-government Federberg wants European governments to form all-out police states so that they can enjoy the cultural enrichment of Islamic immigration. Small price to pay I guess.

Lol! I was waiting for you. To safeguard our freedoms we need intelligence services that are effective. Most of us don't live in a fantasy land with gun toting hillbillies mate. I have no doubt they're muslim, but that doesn't indict the entire religion mate. Otherwise we might as well indict Christianity as well. By my count the muslims are millions behind in the mass murder stakes. This is a problem that has more to do with economics than religion. But people like you might feel happy playing the race/religion card. Keep trying to sell your product, but don't whine when most of us don't buy it

 

[calitennis127]

Federberg, we have already established beyond a shadow of a doubt that you are a complete ignoramus with respect to Islam. You do not know anything about it and you have never studied it except for reading some superficial articles by anti-Christian boneheads at the BBC.

Second, there is a difference between having intelligence services and then living under a police state. What France and Belgium and Germany are becoming are overt police states.

Third, how in the world is Christianity responsible for mass murder? Go ahead and even attempt to justify that ridiculous assertion.

 

[calitennis127]

It is also funny to see Federberg citing the oft-refuted retarded argument that poverty causes these attacks. This must explain why so many jihadists were born and educated in the West and still come to hate it.

Jihadi John got a college degree in computer programming. Anwar al-Awlaki was in a PH.D. program at George Washington. Khalid Sheikh Mohammed had a Master's degree from North Carolina A&T University. Syed Farooq had a college degree. The list goes on and on, yet dolts like Federberg still blame these attacks on poverty.

 

[Bert]

Yes, and I confess I'm not a fan of a political EU federal system. I'd rather the UK stayed out and just limited the relationship to trade.

Agree that if one isn't already in place (and like you, I don't know of one existing) then a Pan-European security agency should be in place.

I think the main issue is that the people involved in Paris or Brussels attacks were locals. Some of them never travelled outside Europe. There are dozens of people who are radicalised and who are ready to "make someting" when they will decide, how they will decide and where they will decide. How can we manage it ?
Checking someone who has an explosive belt in an airport is already too late, it has to be stopped upstream.
I cannot see how it can be done unless going more into people privacy, checking phone calls, internet communications, bank operations on a very larger scale. Are we ready for that ?
When France decided "emergency state" which was, IMO, not very intrusive, so many people complained saying that this was affecting their privacy or freedom.

Not easy

 

[calitennis127]

I think the main issue is that the people involved in Paris or Brussels attacks were locals. Some of them never travelled outside Europe. There are dozens of people who are radicalised and who are ready to "make someting" when they will decide, how they will decide and where they will decide. How can we manage it ?
Checking someone who has an explosive belt in an airport is already too late, it has to be stopped upstream.
I cannot see how it can be done unless going more into people privacy, checking phone calls, internet communications, bank operations on a very larger scale. Are we ready for that ?
When France decided "emergency state" which was, IMO, not very intrusive, so many people complained saying that this was affecting their privacy or freedom.

Not easy

Bert, this is what Federberg wants. He claims he is for small government, but he advocates a massive police state to crack down on Islamic extremists, while also calling on those states to bring in bigger and bigger numbers of Muslims. Federberg and the ignoramuses who rule Europe need large numbers of Muslims in Europe for their own moral satisfaction.

 

[Bert]

Bert, this is what Federberg wants. He claims he is for small government, but he advocates a massive police state to crack down on Islamic extremists, while also calling on those states to bring in bigger and bigger numbers of Muslims. Federberg and the ignoramuses who rule Europe need large numbers of Muslims in Europe for their own moral satisfaction.

Just to be clear with what I said, there is a clear difference in my mind between Muslims and terrorists. They are two distinct groups.
If tomorrow, a group of terrorists related to any faith does the same thing as yesterday, I would post exactly the same comment.

I am not talking of who they are and why they are doing what they do. I am just saying, as they are locals and act on their own initiative with very limited outside guidance, this is very hard to control.

There is a good example of a self-radicalised man who assaulted a teacher in a Jewish school in France few weeks ago. He was from a non-muslim family, clear police records, just got self-radicalised browsing websites and videos, and decided by his own to assault a Jewish school. How you can prevent this ? This has nothing to do with immigration or religion.

 

[calitennis127]

Bert, this has everything to do with Islam. The people who assert otherwise simply do not know much about Islam and are unwilling to acknowledge the truth about it even if they get a sniff of it.

There are dozens of Islamic terrorist groups throughout the world. No other religion even comes close to producing the same number of terrorist groups. Here is just a short list:

- Al-Qaeda
- Boko Haram
- Al-Shabaab
- Al-Nusra
- Lashkar-e-Taiba
- ISIS
- Hezbollah
- Hamas

Show me any other religion that produces anything like this in the world today, or has produced it in the past.

Oh yeah, I forgot. Those damn Taoists.