2025 ATP General News

MargaretMcAleer

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ATP500 Swiss Indoors, Basel
Sunday 26th October,

J. Fonseca vs A.Davidovich Fokina ( note Foki is playing for his 1st ATP title )
 

El Dude

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Fonseca happened...

Yes, Fonseca seemed stagnant, I even thought he made some steps backwards, but... Among the results there are the Davis and Laver cup matches, against high ranked opponents. And I do think that he and his team are actively adapting his game, hence the strange matches.

Also, waiting to pounce on the very last bit of the season was a smart move. I guess even winning the title he will go full steam to Paris, specially given his first round opponent.
Yeah, I think he was consolidating, adjusting to the limelight and the rhythm of the tour. The talent is there to be great, even if we're not yet seeing it in results beyond a match here and there. This is also why I don't rely entirely on age-related accomplishments (i.e. X rank or Y title by Z age). That stuff is a good starting point, but ultimately it comes down to their talent - and this is where I always balance that analysis with the eyeball test and listening to what people who have a sense of such things are saying. In a way, it is sort of 50-50 (for me): statistical thresholds and talent assessment. I focus on the latter because I can do it, and mostly rely on others for the latter, whether Gill Gross and Andy Roddick, or my friends here.

I think of players who rated well in the former but never amounted to much: Coric and Tomic come to mind, but there are many others. I don't remember many people seeing either as future stars - it is just that they appeared on the radar at a very young age (Kyrgios, who was a bit older than Coric but showed up on the radar around the same time, was a bit more promising). For awhile, both were the youngest player in the top 100. Tomic had that impressive run at Wimbledon in 2011 at 18 that made everyone pay attention, then he plateaued around #50 for a few years ago before surging into the top 20 in 2015. By then, though, he was already 22-23, and players who first enter the top 20 at that age literally never become greats, and only a few end up as elites. That's where the threshold analysis is useful.

For Coric, it wasn't as much a particular tournament or win as it was that he snuck into the top 100 at 17, just before his 18th birthday - largely on account of a Challenger title. He finished 102, then kept rising with solid play as an 18-year old, reaching as high as #33 before finishing 2015 at #44. Meaning, his 2015 was similar to Fonseca's, at least in terms of overall performance and age. Probably Coric's signature win that season was beating Andy Murray in the SF of Dubai, though got crushed by Roger in the final. Anyhow, I remember people talking about him having limited upside due to a lack of weapons. That turned out to be totally true, although Coric did end up improbably winning the Cincinnati Masters in 2022.

All of this is my long-winded way of reiterating the point: rising in the ranks at a very young age is an important start to displaying potential future greatness (or eliteness), but it can sometimes be relatively empty. By the eyeball test, Tomic was probably a bit more impressive than Coric, but neither really wowed anyone with their talent (iirc).

One final note about Fonseca. One reason I'm not too worried about his seeming stagnancy is that I think we tend to be somewhat jaded and think that it is "Alcaraz-Nadal or bust." Sinner took awhile to fully mature - showing steady growth (and a bit of backsliding in 2022) before really showing us what he was in late 2023, around his 22nd birthday. Roger's rise was slow relative to other greats. Even Rafa spent a couple years in the middle of the top 100 before surging. Or we could look at Pete Sampras, who did breakout as an elite at a young age (1990, or 18-19) but took a couple of seasons in the back-end of the top 100 to surge, and then after winning the 1990 US Open, took almost three more years to win his next Slam. Fonseca is still very young - and really, he's a young 19 in terms of how much he's played - this is really his first full year on tour. In a way, I think the flashes of peak moments are more important than consistency, which will come as he gets used to the grind of the tour.

2026 should be a lot of fun to watch. If people haven't taken note of Fonseca yet, I think they will next year. I think a reasonable expectation is that he breaks into the top 20 (maybe top 10, but I'll see that as a bonus), and wins a few titles (maybe a Masters, but again - that's a bonus). I think he'll go deep at some big tournaments, though I don't expect him to be a regular contender at most until 2027. But we shall see!
 

El Dude

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ATP500 Swiss Indoors, Basel
Sunday 26th October,

J. Fonseca vs A.Davidovich Fokina ( note Foki is playing for his 1st ATP title )
I'm torn on this one. I'm a fan of Fonseca, but poor Foki...dude is so overdue. Plus, there's this...
Screenshot 2025-10-25 at 3.19.42 PM.png
 

mrzz

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but neither really wowed anyone with their talent (iirc).
I actually think that Tomic is very talented. He is a complete dick, arrogant and lazy, and if it wasn't for his talent he would never have broken into the top 500, honestly. On one hand, I hate him for the reasons above, but on the other, I like his unorthodox style. I get that it is easy to mix up an unortodhox style with (above average) talent, but again I do think Tomic has both. Oddly enough every now and then I check his results on the smaller tours (he was playing futures a year ago, now he got back to challengers and the occasional ATP). Not sure why I kind of root for him.

About tomorrow's final, I guess Fonseca is the favorite. Just got a long highlights reel of his match with Munar, it was very high level (and the stats confirm that). I like Fokina as well, but I do not think he has what it takes to beat Fonseca when he is playing that well. I mean, he can play pretty well too, but I do not think he can play that well at 4 all in the third. Fonseca, on the other hand, already proved that he can. But no match in tennis is decided the day before, so let's see what happens. I am happy either way.
 
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MargaretMcAleer

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Phew what a match! ( Jannik was cramping a bit midway through the 3rd set but stayed strong )
Jannik with super FH down the line winner and will serve for the match against Zverev
I am not a fan of Zverev at all, still I always try to give credit where it is due, that 1st set Zverev won 63 was the best aggressive tennis he has played all year.
 
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MargaretMcAleer

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Sinner d Zverev 36 63 75 in Vienna
21st consecutive indoor win
4th title of the year!
10th consecutive win in Vienna
22nd Career title
Jannik Forza!

Sinner W 46 UFE 21 Zverev W 28 UFE 34
 
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MargaretMcAleer

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I have been keeping SB on Fonseca's match I will now watch live
Fonseca won the 1st set 6-3 and has a early break in the 2nd set
I feel everything has come together for Fonseca this week in Basel, the fhand again on fire, he is such instinctive net player as well, so good to watch, also he can change direction, both on the fhand and bhand wing
Fonseca will now serve for the match and his biggest title to date at 5-4
A love service game to win the ATP500 title 63 64 well done Fonseca, love watching you play!
Fonseca is the 2nd youngest Basel champion ( Courier being the youngest ) and his mum and dad fly into Basel to watch their son!
Tough for Foki to lose another final, though Fonseca just took the racket out of Foki's hands.
With this win Joao officially cracks the Top 30!
 
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MargaretMcAleer

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Shapovalov who has arrived in Paris, confirms he has been struggling with a knee injury, ( not the same one that got injured a few years ago). He's going to practice tomorrow and see how that feels before deciding if he plays or not.
 

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Look at the Fonz. Winning a 500 title indoors. And yet some folk on this board was worried about him. The boy is still a teenager, give him time.
 

MargaretMcAleer

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Apparently Fonseca made a promise to his team if he won, one of these indoor tournaments, he will shave off his hair?
Lets see if he makes his promise, next tournament is Paris
 

MargaretMcAleer

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Paris Update:
IN: Opelka ( LL will play against Moutet
Kovacevic ( LL will play against Kecmanovic)
 

El Dude

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Look at the Fonz. Winning a 500 title indoors. And yet some folk on this board was worried about him. The boy is still a teenager, give him time.
LOL, that's a bit of over-exaggeration there. I think only mrzz and I have expressed any concern - and I said just about exactly the same thing as you did: He's still very young, and concern is likely irrational, even if I felt a twinge of it, likely due to investment as I really want him to succeed. I can't speak for mrzz, but he watches him closer than any on this board and I think felt like his game wasn't really improving. But he wasn't too worried, either.

Players often don't develop in a steady, step-by-step linear manner. It often involves jumps forward, sort of in a jump-plateau-jump-plateau cycle. Hopefully this is another jump. The next would involve going deep in a Slam and/or winning a Masters.

I do kind of like how he seems to be working up the tournament types: First a 250, now a 500. Up next a 1000...maybe during clay season? I think he might win a small tournament or two before his first Masters, but who knows. In the mean-time, my big hope is that he makes it to the SF of Paris so we get to see him play Alcaraz on a big stage, where I expect he'd get trounced. But he's got to beat a bunch of good players to get there, and I suspect will let down a bit after his big win today and go out in the third round to De Minaur or QF to Fritz, if not an exhaustion loss to Khachanov in the second. But we shall see.
 
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MargaretMcAleer

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Wow this is new!
On the mens side for Australian tour - level events including AO itself, will be based on 17th November 2025 year end rankings!
 

El Dude

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Wow this is new!
On the mens side for Australian tour - level events including AO itself, will be based on 17th November 2025 year end rankings!
I didn't realize that was new. Were they previously based on rankings before the Tour Finals? Or afterthe lead-off ATP 250s like Brisbane and Sydney?
 

MargaretMcAleer

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I didn't realize that was new. Were they previously based on rankings before the Tour Finals? Or afterthe lead-off ATP 250s like Brisbane and Sydney?
This concerns all of singles main draw, singles qualifying and doubles entries
Despite the rankings cut off date change, entry lists will be out in a traditional time frame, for AO its 6 weeks before the event start for main draw and 4 weeks before qualifying
This way they kind of extending off season for Top 200/250 players who now has no reason to kill themselves first half of December at challengers/ITFs trying to gain ground on each other in order to make the AO cut
Whilke
EG, the 2025 AO used the ranking on a specific date in December 2024, not the year end ranking from November, to decide its main draw.
Wile a year end ranking is used for most of the ATP tour, tournaments such as the AO have specific entry cut off dates.
 
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Moxie

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Phew what a match! ( Jannik was cramping a bit midway through the 3rd set but stayed strong )
Jannik with super FH down the line winner and will serve for the match against Zverev
I am not a fan of Zverev at all, still I always try to give credit where it is due, that 1st set Zverev won 63 was the best aggressive tennis he has played all year.
Meant to say this before, but I agree with you that Zverev played some aggressive and very good tennis, especially in the first set. Sinner looked a bit hobbled in the first though, and had some cramping issues in the 3rd (what is that about??) and still, Zed, with some of his best tennis, couldn't beat him. That should discourage him, a bit. But, he should keep up with the aggressive posture.
 
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MargaretMcAleer

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Meant to say this before, but I agree with you that Zverev played some aggressive and very good tennis, especially in the first set. Sinner looked a bit hobbled in the first though, and had some cramping issues in the 3rd (what is that about??) and still, Zed, with some of his best tennis, couldn't beat him. That should discourage him, a bit. But, he should keep up with the aggressive posture.
Quite frankly Zed 1st serve which was good in many ways allowed him to win the 1st set, while being aggressive, I dont think Sinner looked hobbled in the first set, he had his chances, at the end of the day Sinner has a higher rating game than Zed period., look at the Winners and UFE errors in the match, which also cost Zed, Sinner feeling his hamstrings midway in the 3rd set, kept his mind on the job and produced first strike tennis which won him the match and the title
 
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