Borg McEnroe

[El Dude]

I finally saw this film last night and really enjoyed it. The actors did a fine job and it really gives a glimpse into the minds of these two iconic greats, as well as tennis of around 1980.

For those unfamiliar with the movie, it is centered around their 1980 Wimbledon final, although half the film is biographical flashbacks for both players. The film follows both, although the emphasis seems slightly more on Borg. I also loved the depiction of Vitas Gerulaitis.

If the film is accurate, it painted a picture of Borg that I wasn't fully aware of: that he was really quite tightly wound and had an immense routine to keep his emotions under check. The film implies, if not outright states, that he retired so young mostly because he simply couldn't stand the intense pressure anymore - but it was an internal pressure to keep his emotions in check.

There was a point in the film where his coach, Lennart Bergelin, said something to the effect that Borg wouldn't be able to handle not being the best, that he would completely collapse when he slipped. This implies that even if he had played on, with McEnroe surpassing--as he did by 1981--he might not have won that much more. But we'll never know.

Anyhow, it was nice to see an actually good tennis film. Battle of the Sexes, also from 2017, was also quite good. Other than that, not much out there (I suppose Wimbledon was cute).

My only complaint about the film is that I didn't love the actual tennis scenes. I'm used to watching actual matches, or highlights of actual matches, and these were obviously staged, without much really good action. I'm not sure how they could have done it otherwise, but it was very "set proppy," if that makes sense.

Highly recommended. I just love the scene near the end, in the airport - very touching.

 

[monfed]

ya good movie..enjoyed it..

 

[Horsa]

I finally saw this film last night and really enjoyed it. The actors did a fine job and it really gives a glimpse into the minds of these two iconic greats, as well as tennis of around 1980.

For those unfamiliar with the movie, it is centered around their 1980 Wimbledon final, although half the film is biographical flashbacks for both players. The film follows both, although the emphasis seems slightly more on Borg. I also loved the depiction of Vitas Gerulaitis.

If the film is accurate, it painted a picture of Borg that I wasn't fully aware of: that he was really quite tightly wound and had an immense routine to keep his emotions under check. The film implies, if not outright states, that he retired so young mostly because he simply couldn't stand the intense pressure anymore - but it was an internal pressure to keep his emotions in check.

There was a point in the film where his coach, Lennart Bergelin, said something to the effect that Borg wouldn't be able to handle not being the best, that he would completely collapse when he slipped. This implies that even if he had played on, with McEnroe surpassing--as he did by 1981--he might not have won that much more. But we'll never know.

Anyhow, it was nice to see an actually good tennis film. Battle of the Sexes, also from 2017, was also quite good. Other than that, not much out there (I suppose Wimbledon was cute).

My only complaint about the film is that I didn't love the actual tennis scenes. I'm used to watching actual matches, or highlights of actual matches, and these were obviously staged, without much really good action. I'm not sure how they could have done it otherwise, but it was very "set proppy," if that makes sense.

Highly recommended. I just love the scene near the end, in the airport - very touching.

Thank you very much for the recommendation. It sounds like a really good film & will go on my recommendations list.

 

[britbox]

I finally saw this film last night and really enjoyed it. The actors did a fine job and it really gives a glimpse into the minds of these two iconic greats, as well as tennis of around 1980.

For those unfamiliar with the movie, it is centered around their 1980 Wimbledon final, although half the film is biographical flashbacks for both players. The film follows both, although the emphasis seems slightly more on Borg. I also loved the depiction of Vitas Gerulaitis.

If the film is accurate, it painted a picture of Borg that I wasn't fully aware of: that he was really quite tightly wound and had an immense routine to keep his emotions under check. The film implies, if not outright states, that he retired so young mostly because he simply couldn't stand the intense pressure anymore - but it was an internal pressure to keep his emotions in check.

There was a point in the film where his coach, Lennart Bergelin, said something to the effect that Borg wouldn't be able to handle not being the best, that he would completely collapse when he slipped. This implies that even if he had played on, with McEnroe surpassing--as he did by 1981--he might not have won that much more. But we'll never know.

Anyhow, it was nice to see an actually good tennis film. Battle of the Sexes, also from 2017, was also quite good. Other than that, not much out there (I suppose Wimbledon was cute).

My only complaint about the film is that I didn't love the actual tennis scenes. I'm used to watching actual matches, or highlights of actual matches, and these were obviously staged, without much really good action. I'm not sure how they could have done it otherwise, but it was very "set proppy," if that makes sense.

Highly recommended. I just love the scene near the end, in the airport - very touching.

Borg's retirement is interesting. He did carry on playing some big stakes exhibitions after official retirement... some of them for huge money and held his own v JMac in those. He struggled more against Connors in the money exhos.

 

[Chris Koziarz]

Borg's retirement is interesting. He did carry on playing some big stakes exhibitions after official retirement... some of them for huge money and held his own v JMac in those. He struggled more against Connors in the money exhos.

That confirms Dude's understanding that Borg could play big matches but must have retired from the tour because he could not handle the pressure to be the best.

 

[britbox]

That confirms Dude's understanding that Borg could play big matches but must have retired from the tour because he could not handle the pressure to be the best.

Yeah, I agree it was burnout. I posted this on an old thread when we discussed it once previously:

Borg was told he had to play 10 events in 1982 and he'd only committed to 7. On that basis, he was told he would have to play the qualifiers for the Grand Slam events. He wasn't going to do it. He didn't formally retire until 1983 but still played invitationals in 82 and 83 including matches against Connors and McEnroe.

These weren't soft exhibitions but serious money events... The Suntory Open invitational in 1983 for instance had a prize pool of $250,000 for a four man field.... compare that to $66,000 for winning Wimbledon in the same year. Borg beat McEnroe in straight sets before losing a final to Connors. They were serious matches. I don't think Borg shirked the McEnroe challenge... he was burnt out.

 

[El Dude]

What was interesting about the film is how it depicted Borg's relationship to his own bottled up emotions - how he made the leap from being an angry 15 year old to best player in the world by learning how to suppress is emotions and channel that energy into his play.

That bottling up created immense tension within him, which was clearly exhausting - thus the burn out.

When he tried to come back ten years later, he utterly failed. I know he was in his mid-30s, but you'd think the former greatest player in the world would have been able to do a bit better than he did. Clearly the game had passed him by, but I also wonder if he had softened over the years and didn't have that inner fire.

 

[Nadalfan2013]

OK guys this is all very boring :sleep:, let's please go back to Rafa vs Fed vs Nole disputes. ::sw1::

 

[Horsa]

OK guys this is all very boring :sleep:, let's please go back to Rafa vs Fed vs Nole disputes. ::sw1::

I don't think so. I used to like John McEnroe. If you want to talk Rafa, Fed & Nole there are lots of places for you to do that. Let people who want to talk about Borg & McEnroe do it, please.

 

[Ricardo]

What was interesting about the film is how it depicted Borg's relationship to his own bottled up emotions - how he made the leap from being an angry 15 year old to best player in the world by learning how to suppress is emotions and channel that energy into his play.

That bottling up created immense tension within him, which was clearly exhausting - thus the burn out.

When he tried to come back ten years later, he utterly failed. I know he was in his mid-30s, but you'd think the former greatest player in the world would have been able to do a bit better than he did. Clearly the game had passed him by, but I also wonder if he had softened over the years and didn't have that inner fire.

The game didn’t, more like the equipment that gave huge advantages while he insisted using wooden racquets. Fair to say anyone using wooden racquets today would get smashed no matter how good you were.

 

[Fiero425]

I don't think so. I used to like John McEnroe. If you want to talk Rafa, Fed & Nole there are lots of places for you to do that. Let people who want to talk about Borg & McEnroe do it, please.

What a nerve! The title should have told it all, but some clown wants to talk about Fedalovic! I feel their pain, but that was just idiotic! :cuckoo:

 

[Horsa]

What a nerve! The title should have told it all, but some clown wants to talk about Fedalovic! I feel their pain, but that was just idiotic! :cuckoo:

That's what I thought. They'll be wanting all the non-tennis sections to be about Fedalovic next.

 

[Moxie]

What was interesting about the film is how it depicted Borg's relationship to his own bottled up emotions - how he made the leap from being an angry 15 year old to best player in the world by learning how to suppress is emotions and channel that energy into his play.

That bottling up created immense tension within him, which was clearly exhausting - thus the burn out.

When he tried to come back ten years later, he utterly failed. I know he was in his mid-30s, but you'd think the former greatest player in the world would have been able to do a bit better than he did. Clearly the game had passed him by, but I also wonder if he had softened over the years and didn't have that inner fire.

I haven't seen the film yet, but I did live through the era as a Borg fan. He was a tense guy, with all of he endless rituals. IMO, the burn-out wasn't just tension. There was superstardom, which was new to tennis. And a lot of partying. I don't know if it came out in the film, but cocaine was a feature, in those days.

 

[El Dude]

I haven't seen the film yet, but I did live through the era as a Borg fan. He was a tense guy, with all of he endless rituals. IMO, the burn-out wasn't just tension. There was superstardom, which was new to tennis. And a lot of partying. I don't know if it came out in the film, but cocaine was a feature, in those days.

They didn't touch on that with Borg, although they showed him at Studio 54 with Gerulaitis, who was depicted (accurately) as a wild party guy. But there were no scenes with Borg coking up.

 

[Moxie]

They didn't touch on that with Borg, although they showed him at Studio 54 with Gerulaitis, who was depicted (accurately) as a wild party guy. But there were no scenes with Borg coking up.

Oh, yes, when Gerulaitis died, everyone thought it was drugs. However, he'd gotten clean, and it was sadly just a malfunctioning AC at a friend's house. Stupid. As to Borg, I have to say, and as a huge fan, the thinking was that coke was involved. You don't make that much money and then go bankrupt so quickly after. In those days, it went up the nose. I don't want to slander the guy, but it seemed clear at the time.

 

[britbox]

Agree with Moxie on this one - I think Borg got introduced to the Colombian Marching Powder and it messed him up for a while.

 

[Nadalfan2013]

They should do a movie about Rafa's humanitarian contributions and amazing generosity, also never breaking a racket and being a great role model for kids. Maybe a 2 part movie kind of like Lord of the Rings. I can't believe that they made a movie about McEnroe, the guy had no manners, just horrible behavior, no class whatsoever.

 

[Horsa]

They should do a movie about Rafa's humanitarian contributions and amazing generosity, also never breaking a racket and being a great role model for kids. Maybe a 2 part movie kind of like Lord of the Rings. I can't believe that they made a movie about McEnroe, the guy had no manners, just horrible behavior, no class whatsoever.

I agree. They should make a Rafa vs Fed the movie. John McEnroe's behaviour towards the umpire was disgusting but it was entertaining. He had anger management issues like a lot of people (me included sometimes but I put my temper down to being mainly Scots/Irish genealogically & bottling everything up until I either explode or implode but since then I learnt to express myself poetically or by singing or writing crescendos *singing crescendos works very well as I express my anger vocally & crescendos mimic this as they start quiet & keep getting louder until they reach a climax too + it's always o.k. to raise your voice in song especially when you've got a nice voice* though this doesn't always work) which he didn't do anything about. People have to accept they have a problem & want to do something about it before things happen or get worse. He was the only tennis player I know who had a catchphrase which was "You cannot be serious. That wasn't out. It was in" normally before he threw his racquet. The fact of the matter though is they haven't made a Rafa film but a Borg McEnroe film & that is what is being discussed though you look on it with disgust.

 

[El Dude]

As great as the Fed-Rafa rivalry has been, I don't think it quite has the story or sex appeal of Borg-McEnroe. Furthermore, this sort of movie really needs to be made years after they retire.

 

[Horsa]

Hmm! Good points there. The explosiveness of McEnroe's arguments with the umpire had great entertainment value in themselves. Rafa & Fed's story is still being written. Who knows what tomorrow brings though?