2025 US Open Final: Alcaraz vs. Sinner

[PhiEaglesfan712]

Let's not make excuses for Carlos. He just had an off day in the finals. Just like Jannik had an off day against Dmitrov. It happens. The only difference is that Jannik's opponent got hurt. Otherwise, we might be talking about Dmitrov or Ben Shelton being a Wimbledon Champion.

 

[Kieran]

Let's not make excuses for Carlos. He just had an off day in the finals. Just like Jannik had an off day against Dmitrov. It happens. The only difference is that Jannik's opponent got hurt. Otherwise, we might be talking about Dmitrov or Ben Shelton being a Wimbledon Champion.

There’s no way we’d be talking about them as Wimbledon champion. We’d have had the same final we had the 2 previous years, with the same champion..

 

[PhiEaglesfan712]

There’s no way we’d be talking about them as Wimbledon champion. We’d have had the same final we had the 2 previous years, with the same champion..

Don't forget that Djokovic hurt himself in the closing points of his quarterfinal match. (This is another event in the string of unbelieveable luck that allowed Sinner to win the title.) Djokovic was compromised in the semi, and likely would have lost to whoever showed up that day.

Otherwise, I agree with you that Djokovic would have pulled it off. A healthy Djokovic just doesn't lose at Wimbledon. Only to players like Federer, Murray, del Potro, and Alcaraz. (And with the way Alcaraz played in the final, a healthy Djokovic would have probably won that day.)

 

[Kieran]

Don't forget that Djokovic hurt himself in the closing points of his quarterfinal match. (This is another event in the string of unbelieveable luck that allowed Sinner to win the title.) Djokovic was compromised in the semi, and likely would have lost to whoever showed up that day.

Otherwise, I agree with you that Djokovic would have pulled it off. A healthy Djokovic just doesn't lose at Wimbledon. Only to players like Federer, Murray, del Potro, and Alcaraz. (And with the way Alcaraz played in the final, a healthy Djokovic would have probably won that day.)

Djokovic wouldn’t have won, it would have been like last year. Sinner played an exceptional match to win the final, I don’t think Djoker could have.

By the way, Dimitrov was winning against Sinner, but there’s no guarantee he would have won that match..

 

[kskate2]

I think you’re right about queens. I think Carlos had such a huge fight in the FO Final that he might have been wiser to pay a couple of matches at queens then duck out. I didn’t think so at the time, and I even contradicted someone here (@kskate2 ?) but I was wrong on that, and there were right…

who me? Welp. I was surprised he even made a showing at Queens after the RG final and the party in Ibiza. But glad he showed up and won a couple of matches. Then I guess he got greedy and was looking for another grass court title.

 

[kskate2]

who me? Welp. I was surprised he even made a showing at Queens after the RG final and the party in Ibiza. But glad he showed up and won a couple of matches. Then I guess he got greedy and was looking for another grass court title.

We can't blame it all on Queens though it was a catalyst. Remember, he spent alot of time on court during the fortnight. He had that weird 5 setter w/ F3 and then a few 4 setters along the way. It's probably why he played so well in NY. I think he learned from Wimby not to expend too much energy in the early rounds. He already knows what will be waiting for him in the SF and Finals.

 

[Jelenafan]

Queens was not the downfall for Alcatraz, it was simply his serve let him down in the Wimbledon final. Sinner’s strategy worked, but let’s face it, it worked in part with substandard serving by Carlos.

 

[Jelenafan]

We can't blame it all on Queens though it was a catalyst. Remember, he spent alot of time on court during the fortnight. He had that weird 5 setter w/ F3 and then a few 4 setters along the way. It's probably why he played so well in NY. I think he learned from Wimby not to expend too much energy in the early rounds. He already knows what will be waiting for him in the SF and Finals.

Maybe, but I call this the “we don’t know if it will have an effect until the final result” armchair quarterbacking, though.

How many times have we seen a player breeze through the early rounds & then lose in the Finals & the story then becomes “too easy, wasn’t truly tested” or in contrast someone pulls an Alcaraz 2022 USO playing multiple sets & if they win the finals the story morphs into “all those matches gave him enough confidence & focus & toughened him just enough”

IF Alcaraz had won the W final then the Storyline may have been “ that Queens prep gave him enough momentum & rhythm to take Wimbledon.”

That played out IIRC in 2008 when Rafa won the FO, played & won Queens & went on to win the finals at Wimbledon over Federer.

 

[PhiEaglesfan712]

The Queen's excuse is BS. If Carlos got upset in the early rounds, then there may be merit to it, but he made the Final. Carlos just had an off day in the Final. That's all.

Even Federer and Djokovic were not immune to off days.

I just wish Grigor would have stayed healthy. That Grigor-Ben Shelton match would have been awesome. Ben's breakthrough or Grigor pulling a 2001 Goran run would have been much more fun to watch than seeing Sinner lift another trophy.

 

[Fiero425]

Maybe, but I call this the “we don’t know if it will have an effect until the final result” armchair quarterbacking, though.

How many times have we seen a player breeze through the early rounds & then lose in the Finals & the story then becomes “too easy, wasn’t truly tested” or in contrast someone pulls an Alcaraz 2022 USO playing multiple sets & if they win the finals the story morphs into “all those matches gave him enough confidence & focus & toughened him just enough”

IF Alcaraz had won the W final then the Storyline may have been “ that Queens prep gave him enough momentum & rhythm to take Wimbledon.”

That played out IIRC in 2008 when Rafa won the FO, played & won Queens & went on to win the finals at Wimbledon over Federer.

If I were Nadal's publicist, thru a # of choices, happenstance,, injury, & family drama, he probably should have had huge bragging rights for his client w/ a "run for the ages!" It might have even ecliped all Novak would have done if not for unforseen circumstances! By 2008, I wasn't watching tennis as much w/ Federer winning everything in sight! It really got old w/ all of us ignoring the facts that he was being owned by some kid; esp. on clay! Rafa own 2008, de-throning Roger at Wimbledon along the way! After making Roger cry stealing the 2009 AO Final, I wasn't sure if I could take it! Never cared for Nadal's play! Luckily he was upset at the FO allowing Roger to complete his Career Grand Slam! Roger barely survived Roddick at Wimbledon, then upset in the USO Final by Del Po! Rafa Got it going again in In the Summer of 2010 running thru the last 3 majors! Nadal was playing well thru 2011, but not for the excellence of Djokovic who stopped him in 6 Biggie finals in a row, Nadal might have been on top of the recordbks instead! Could you imagine Rafa owning 2008-12? Thank the Heavens Novak came of age in time to stop that "RUN!" END RANT!

 

[Jelenafan]

If I were Nadal's publicist, thru a # of choices, happenstance,, injury, & family drama, he probably should have had huge bragging rights for his client w/ a "run for the ages!" It might have even ecliped all Novak would have done if not for unforseen circumstances! By 2008, I wasn't watching tennis as much w/ Federer winning everything in sight! It really got old w/ all of us ignoring the facts that he was being owned by some kid; esp. on clay! Rafa own 2008, de-throning Roger at Wimbledon along the way! After making Roger cry stealing the 2009 AO Final, I wasn't sure if I could take it! Never cared for Nadal's play! Luckily he was upset at the FO allowing Roger to complete his Career Grand Slam! Roger barely survived Roddick at Wimbledon, then upset in the USO Final by Del Po! Rafa Got it going again in In the Summer of 2010 running thru the last 3 majors! Nadal was playing well thru 2011, but not for the excellence of Djokovic who stopped him in 6 Biggie finals in a row, Nadal might have been on top of the recordbks instead! Could you imagine Rafa owning 2008-12? Thank the Heavens Novak came of age in time to stop that "RUN!" END RANT!

Oh Fiero, your dislike of Nadal, you are consistent I give you that much… ; )

 

[atttomole]

If I were Nadal's publicist, thru a # of choices, happenstance,, injury, & family drama, he probably should have had huge bragging rights for his client w/ a "run for the ages!" It might have even ecliped all Novak would have done if not for unforseen circumstances! By 2008, I wasn't watching tennis as much w/ Federer winning everything in sight! It really got old w/ all of us ignoring the facts that he was being owned by some kid; esp. on clay! Rafa own 2008, de-throning Roger at Wimbledon along the way! After making Roger cry stealing the 2009 AO Final, I wasn't sure if I could take it! Never cared for Nadal's play! Luckily he was upset at the FO allowing Roger to complete his Career Grand Slam! Roger barely survived Roddick at Wimbledon, then upset in the USO Final by Del Po! Rafa Got it going again in In the Summer of 2010 running thru the last 3 majors! Nadal was playing well thru 2011, but not for the excellence of Djokovic who stopped him in 6 Biggie finals in a row, Nadal might have been on top of the recordbks instead! Could you imagine Rafa owning 2008-12? Thank the Heavens Novak came of age in time to stop that "RUN!" END RANT!

Tell me more about Sampras. I want to hear more about Sampras.

 

[Fiero425]

Tell me more about Sampras. I want to hear more about Sampras.

Sampras? What about him? OTTH, I believe "back in the day" we anointed him the GOAT! We were so caught up w/ record making history, we allowed Rod Laver to be almost dismissed w/ his 2 CYGS; 1 as an Am.('62) & another as a Pro ('69)! We elevated a player who never even played a FO, much less win it! His record of 14 Majors didn't even last that long (< a decade) as Federer took over as The GOAT in 2009 winning his 15 Major at Wmbledon over his pigeon, A-Rod! I give Pete all due credit owning his era over a lot of talented player, but his finals weren't half as tough as the Big 3's as they vy'd for tennis immortality! WInning Majors over Phillippoussis, Pioline, Chang, & Martin just don't measure up IMO! His last great run at the USO in 2002 became fortuitous as his pigeon, Andre Agassi waited in the final!

 

[atttomole]

The

Sampras? What about him? OTTH, I believe "back in the day" we anointed him the GOAT! We were so caught up w/ record making history, we allowed Rod Laver to be almost dismissed w/ his 2 CYGS; 1 as an Am.('62) & another as a Pro ('69)! We elevated a player who never even played a FO, much less win it! His record of 14 Majors didn't even last that long (< a decade) as Federer took over as The GOAT in 2009 winning his 15 Major at Wmbledon over his pigeon, A-Rod! I give Pete all due credit owning his era over a lot of talented player, but his finals weren't half as tough as the Big 3's as they vy'd for tennis immortality! WInning Majors over Phillippoussis, Pioline, Chang, & Martin just don't measure up IMO! His last great run at the USO in 2002 became fortuitous as his pigeon, Andre Agassi waited in the final!

But Sampras was your favorite so.

 

[Fiero425]

The

But Sampras was your favorite so.

True enough! I can still be honest about his standing & how foolish we all look after 20+ yrs. watching the Big 3 obliterate his records!

 

[Jelenafan]

True enough! I can still be honest about his standing & how foolish we all look after 20+ yrs. watching the Big 3 obliterate his records!

Pistol Pete was the YE #1 player in the ATP six consecutive years.

 

[Fiero425]

Pistol Pete was the YE #1 player in the ATP six consecutive years.

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He also got to #1 in '93 being 2 1/2 yrs. removed from winning his '90 USO! Pete mauled Agassi in that final! It took about an hour 1/2!

 

[atttomole]

True enough! I can still be honest about his standing & how foolish we all look after 20+ yrs. watching the Big 3 obliterate his records!

Which is good. You should show us more regularly that you were a fan of his.

 

[Fiero425]

Which is good. You should show us more regularly that you were a fan of his.

Oh, I had to be a huge fan of Pistol Pete! Like any kid, he wasn't perfect & disappointed me a couple times saying & doing something stupid! I was obviously a fan of his allowing him to be proclaimed "The GOAT" back in 2002! I saw & enjoyed Laver, so that was huge; esp. since Sampras had no FO on his resume! Back then we made allowances for elite players w/o a title from Paris; McEnroe, Connors, Sampras even though we had 2 winners, Courier & Chang! I need to go check out an old match! They never seem to play anything from that era on TCC anymore! I miss the old days when there was such limited permissions & access to tournaments, they resorted in telecasting that WITC comp. we spoke about! It was a great exh. event w/ the top players getting early exposure in the Tennis Boom of the mid 70's!

 

[atttomole]

Oh, I had to be a huge fan of Pistol Pete! Like any kid, he wasn't perfect & disappointed me a couple times saying & doing something stupid! I was obviously a fan of his allowing him to be proclaimed "The GOAT" back in 2002! I saw & enjoyed Laver, so that was huge; esp. since Sampras had no FO on his resume! Back then we made allowances for elite players w/o a title from Paris; McEnroe, Connors, Sampras even though we had 2 winners, Courier & Chang! I need to go check out an old match! They never seem to play anything from that era on TCC anymore! I miss the old days when there was such limited permissions & access to tournaments, they resorted in telecasting that WITC comp. we spoke about! It was a great exh. event w/ the top players getting early exposure in the Tennis Boom of the mid 70's!

it makes a lot of sense that you were a huge Sampras fan, given how you cheered at every player that beat Roger. Sampras was a top player. Roger was simply a far better version of him.