US Politics Thread

[Kieran]

I honestly don't know what you mean. I certainly don't understand the comparison to Harris. You understand what code-switching is, right?

Anyway, surely we have bigger fish to fry. What do you care about a woman who represents the 30th District in Texas?

You should fry this fish, and all the other spoofers people like her. Kamala did this so called “code switching” too and I admire the way the left use terms to justify their silliness but in politics it’s racial pandering, and mimicry.

And I don’t really care about her at all, but American Crazy is a thing in left wing politics, and so it’s hard to resist.



Is it Thanksgiving today? Happy Thanksgiving!

 

[Federberg]

Trump is still trying to roll over Ukraine (and, frankly Europe,) and give Putin everything he wants. Credit to Rubio who seems sincerely to be trying to salvage something out of these talks. But he's hampered by Trump.

Trump will never be the person to resolve this. He's too far up Putin's fundament. And he has no respect for NATO, and thus ignores the interests of Europe in this war. Europe will have to do it alone, which may mean sending troops. The US has already said that it has broken its alliance, so it can't get worse when the US refuses to help. Otherwise, this just keeps going. Ukraine is valiantly trying to hold its own, but Putin will never give up until he gets what he wants. I don't see that sanctions are doing anything.

I found Witkoff advising Putin's guy about how to sell the plan to Trump absolutely disgusting. The plan is doomed to fail. It seems to me that Trump is just trying to use the plan to turn around his domestic problems, it won't work. This is just another stalling tactic by Putin. The reality is that at this point peace might be more dangerous for Putin than anything else. What would he do with all the soldiers that come back home? What will he do when Russian families discover the horrific losses? He can't have that

 

[Moxie]

You should fry this fish, and all the other spoofers people like her. Kamala did this so called “code switching” too and I admire the way the left use terms to justify their silliness but in politics it’s racial pandering, and mimicry.

And I don’t really care about her at all, but American Crazy is a thing in left wing politics, and so it’s hard to resist.



Is it Thanksgiving today? Happy Thanksgiving!

"Code-switching" is a linguistic term, not a left wing one. There's nothing silly about it. The highest percentage of people that do it in the US are black, followed by hispanics. There's nothing about it that's "mimicry." You should look into it.

Thanksgiving is tomorrow. (Always the 4th Thursday of November.) Thanks!

 

[Moxie]

I found Witkoff advising Putin's guy about how to sell the plan to Trump absolutely disgusting. The plan is doomed to fail. It seems to me that Trump is just trying to use the plan to turn around his domestic problems, it won't work. This is just another stalling tactic by Putin. The reality is that at this point peace might be more dangerous for Putin than anything else. What would he do with all the soldiers that come back home? What will he do when Russian families discover the horrific losses? He can't have that

Putin is the last person who needs lessons on how to get on Trump's good side, since already grafted on. I just found that confusing. Though, as Mitch McConnell says, and I've believe some of us have been saying here for some months, Putin has been playing Trump for a fool all this year. Trump has counted on his buddy to at least make him look like some great statesman and dealmaker in terms of the peace efforts in Ukraine, and Putin just keeps giving him the finger. Trump's peace proposal looks so favorable to Russia, that supposedly even Rubio initially said it was drafted by Russia.

Big divisions in the Republican part over this. The old guard very against all this Russian appeasement.

I don't know if it's peace that Putin is afraid of, because even the Russians can't tolerate an endless war. But he's not interested in peace. What he wants is the old Soviet Union. He thinks all of Ukraine is Russian. I'm not sure how you solve this. But I sincerely hope that we don't push for Ukraine not to join NATO. Ukraine should join NATO asap.

 

[Federberg]

Putin is the last person who needs lessons on how to get on Trump's good side, since already grafted on. I just found that confusing. Though, as Mitch McConnell says, and I've believe some of us have been saying here for some months, Putin has been playing Trump for a fool all this year. Trump has counted on his buddy to at least make him look like some great statesman and dealmaker in terms of the peace efforts in Ukraine, and Putin just keeps giving him the finger. Trump's peace proposal looks so favorable to Russia, that supposedly even Rubio initially said it was drafted by Russia.

Big divisions in the Republican part over this. The old guard very against all this Russian appeasement.

I don't know if it's peace that Putin is afraid of, because even the Russians can't tolerate an endless war. But he's not interested in peace. What he wants is the old Soviet Union. He thinks all of Ukraine is Russian. I'm not sure how you solve this. But I sincerely hope that we don't push for Ukraine not to join NATO. Ukraine should join NATO asap.

no it's too far gone now. The Russian economy is broken. Too much of it has been shifted to a war platform. The level of disruption to shift back to a non-war economy is beyond their finances. The central bank is currently selling down their gold reserves, this is how bad things are. The Ukrainians have used their kinetic sanctions to destroy nearly half their oil and gas infrastructure as well as their refining capacity. They literally have to continue prosecuting this war otherwise they'll find themselves in a depression on steroids. And that isn't factoring in returning military. Remember the end of the Soviet Union? The end of their Afghan excursion was mild compared to what will follow this. And the Soviet economy took a big hit. This is a magnitude worse. They're well past the point of no return, and Putin and his close circle know it

 

[Moxie]

no it's too far gone now. The Russian economy is broken. Too much of it has been shifted to a war platform. The level of disruption to shift back to a non-war economy is beyond their finances. The central bank is currently selling down their gold reserves, this is how bad things are. The Ukrainians have used their kinetic sanctions to destroy nearly half their oil and gas infrastructure as well as their refining capacity. They literally have to continue prosecuting this war otherwise they'll find themselves in a depression on steroids. And that isn't factoring in returning military. Remember the end of the Soviet Union? The end of their Afghan excursion was mild compared to what will follow this. And the Soviet economy took a big hit. This is a magnitude worse. They're well past the point of no return, and Putin and his close circle know it

So, what, then? Endless war? Let's not pretend that Trump would understand this, but what about some people in the State Department? Or have they finally just fired every competent person in DC?

 

[Federberg]

So, what, then? Endless war? Let's not pretend that Trump would understand this, but what about some people in the State Department? Or have they finally just fired every competent person in DC?

the competent ones keep their heads down and brief in secret.

But re: Putin's endgame... he has to hope that he can win, right now he's getting bad information from his people. Russia is actually losing badly now. Ukraine isn't fighting a territorial war, which is a common error made by the media in describing this conflict. They're spending their resources degrading the Russian military, in terms of personnel, infrastructure and resources. And while they're doing that they're actually increasing their technological advantage at an incredible pace. They are, now, by far the most lethal developers and users of drones. They have changed the very nature of war, and as I've said before, this war is the most meaningful since World War 2, and before that it was the American Civil War. These are great conflicts where the very nature of war is forever changed. Spending money on tanks and jet fighters in significant amounts now is really just wasting money. We're in the age of the drone. My point, saying all this, is that the only certainty that Putin has is that stopping the war will end in his inevitable downfall. But... but if he can break NATO, dissuade Ukraine's allies from providing assistance.. any of those things, then he still has a possible path to survive. That's literally his only option now

 

[Moxie]

Well, WWI, right, though? But all very interesting, thanks!

 

[Federberg]

Well, WWI, right, though? But all very interesting, thanks!

no WW1 was just trench warfare based on the template of the American Civil War. Apart from some relatively minor technological advances, there weren't any significant strategic evolutions

WW2 however, nuclear war...

 

[Moxie]

no WW1 was just trench warfare based on the template of the American Civil War. Apart from some relatively minor technological advances, there weren't any significant strategic evolutions

WW2 however, nuclear war...

OK. I thought WWI, with the new high-powered weapons. It's always spoken of that way, but no matter. I take your point, and about the drones now. Interesting point.

 

[Kieran]

"Code-switching" is a linguistic term, not a left wing one. There's nothing silly about it. The highest percentage of people that do it in the US are black, followed by hispanics. There's nothing about it that's "mimicry." You should look into it.

Thanksgiving is tomorrow. (Always the 4th Thursday of November.) Thanks!

We all should be thankful we can disagree peacefully and start again the next day. Disagreeing again!

 

[Federberg]

OK. I thought WWI, with the new high-powered weapons. It's always spoken of that way, but no matter. I take your point, and about the drones now. Interesting point.

don't get me wrong, WW1, the Great War was incredibly important. It resulted in the destruction of the Austro-Hungarian Empire and the Ottoman Empire. Leading to the creation of a number of Eastern European countries and Middle Eastern countries. But nothing really ground breaking in the field of war, the template had already been set during the American Civil War. But... after WW2 the concept of civilisation ending wars existed. That's a profound difference

 

[Federberg]

Wow..

 

[Moxie]

Wow..

Shocking, and not shocking. Trump has been letting his family and friends feather their nests since his first term. He also thinks that big monetary deals solve everything. But this one is particularly venal. He will prolong the war, let many people be killed, and let Ukraine and Europe hang out to dry for the sake of getting in good with Russian riches. Bolstering Russia will not end well. A businessman, who is only a businessman, with no diplomatic skills, and no sense of the greater geopolitics is not a good world leader.

 

[Moxie]

Trump is considering pardoning the ex-President of Honduras, who was convicted of drug trafficking and corruption. This is a mixed message, compared to his "war on drugs." Hernandez was convicted, in the US, of being involved in transporting massive amounts of cocaine into the US.

Trump is accusing Maduro of Venezuela of essentially the same thing that Hernandez was convicted of, without real evidence. But he'll free the convicted one?

In Hernandez, Trump seems to see a fellow traveler. A President wrongly convicted? But what message does this send? He should leave that one aside. He's got bigger fish to fry, has he not?

On the other hand, Venezuela is simply NOT the biggest source of drugs into the US. So what is Trump's game? Their oil? One has to think so.

Let's be clear: if Trump really cared about the drug crisis in this country, he'd go after the major sources of fentanyl, which are Mexico and China. Also, if he really cared about it, he would deal with the addiction crisis in the US. You can cut off the supply chain, but another will grow, if there is demand. By gutting the resources for drug rehabilitation in this country, he has offered nothing to the people with addiction disease as it exists in the US. Medicaid, for example, is a system that helps people with addiction issues, and he and Republicans are reducing it to the point of nothing. RFK, Jr. has closed the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration, or absorbed it into the group that deals with chemical exposures in the workplace. Seriously?

RFK, Jr. says that the 12-Steps worked for him. And diet and exercise. Well, that's fine, especially if you have money, especially for rehab. What about people who don't have any? Where is the concerted national effort at rehabilitation, paid for by the State? Where is the money for SNAP and Medicaid for people who have both mental health and addiction issues? Put real money into programs to raise these people out of their addictions and their poverty. I didn't see any of that in the Big "Beautiful" Bill.

Trump understands nothing about handling the drug crisis. I think his motivations are other. It's an excuse to deport people, and get a handle on Venezuelan oil, that's all.

 

[Federberg]

Shocking, and not shocking. Trump has been letting his family and friends feather their nests since his first term. He also thinks that big monetary deals solve everything. But this one is particularly venal. He will prolong the war, let many people be killed, and let Ukraine and Europe hang out to dry for the sake of getting in good with Russian riches. Bolstering Russia will not end well. A businessman, who is only a businessman, with no diplomatic skills, and no sense of the greater geopolitics is not a good world leader.

I think this will be grounds for impeachment if the Dems win the House. And while they stand no chance of winning I can't even blame them. This is worse than anything in the first term. These are people... Ukrainians.. he's hanging out to dry, as well as betraying his European allies. I know he's corrupt, but the brazenness is so awful he clearly feels the American political system is so broken that he can get away with it. As George HW said... "this cannot stand"

 

[Moxie]

I think this will be grounds for impeachment if the Dems win the House. And while they stand no chance of winning I can't even blame them. This is worse than anything in the first term. These are people... Ukrainians.. he's hanging out to dry, as well as betraying his European allies. I know he's corrupt, but the brazenness is so awful he clearly feels the American political system is so broken that he can get away with it. As George HW said... "this cannot stand"

I can't see the point of impeaching him again, no matter how egregious. To what end? He was impeached for his part in trying to overthrow an election, FFS, and nothing happened. Investigate misuse of power, yes, and vote to censure him, but the aim should be only to expose misdeeds to the public. Another impeachment would only be seen as a political move.

We're only 10.5 months into his Presidency, and this is only part of the chaos he is sowing. And only part of the corruption of this administration. Hopefully, the Dems win back some power to at least balance things out, a bit, but it's a long time to wait, in "Trump years."

 

[Moxie]

There is much to say about the shooting of two National Guardsmen in DC last Wednesday. First, that it's a tragedy. A 20-year-old woman is dead, and a 24-year-old man is fighting for his life. They were shot by a man who had worked with the CIA in Afghanistan, and is an Afghan national, currently in the US under asylum. Which makes sense. He would surely have been in danger, had he stayed in Afghanistan. He worked for our side.

Trump is calling this an act of terror, and leaping at the excuse to halt visas for many people, not just from Afghanistan, but what he calls Third World Countries. Now, it has been reported that this man was suffering from mental health issues, as a consequence of his experience in the war. Why is it, when a US citizen (read: specifically, mostly, a white man) shoots up a school or a bunch of people at temple or a gay club, it's a "mental health issue," but if an Afghani does it, it's definitely terrorism?

Trump is saying that he was radicalized here in the US. What are the chances? If he wasn't radicalized in Afghanistan, why here in the US? Chances seem much greater that it was PTSD on account of his war experience.

Who knows why the guy drove 2500 miles across the country to shoot someone, but Trump did politicize the National Guard by sending them to various US cities. He put them in harm's way for no reason, and bears some responsibility, IMO.

Also, God forbid anyone should bring up gun safety. Let alone Gabby Giffords, who knows what she's talking about, when it comes to political violence. Doesn't take much to brush that off from the MAGA side:

 

[Fiero425]

I can't see the point of impeaching him again, no matter how egregious. To what end? He was impeached for his part in trying to overthrow an election, FFS, and nothing happened. Investigate misuse of power, yes, and vote to censure him, but the aim should be only to expose misdeeds to the public. Another impeachment would only be seen as a political move.

We're only 10.5 months into his Presidency, and this is only part of the chaos he is sowing. And only part of the corruption of this administration. Hopefully, the Dems win back some power to at least balance things out, a bit, but it's a long time to wait, in "Trump years."

Can the Dems even help the country to recover after this one? I haven't watched any news as I can only SMH as Republicans & conservatives have collectively lost their freakin' minds allowing this tyrant to stomp all over the Constitution! The Supreme Court is rather late to the party as they allowed this man to go as far as he has by literally saying "The President is exempt from the law!" Only of late have they finally decided to act right & disallow his foolishness! When Clinton was president, every little thing he did was investigated w/ Congressional hearings running Millions of $$'s! Even the SC voted 9-0 there was nothing keeping him from being sued while in office! Now Trump can thumb his nose at anyone & anything as he undermines every institution utilizing the Justice Dept. as his own personal plaything punishing his enemies! How do we recover? The next president can't act any worse, but he or she will have tons of leeway after this horrible period in our political history!

 

[Federberg]

I can't see the point of impeaching him again, no matter how egregious. To what end? He was impeached for his part in trying to overthrow an election, FFS, and nothing happened. Investigate misuse of power, yes, and vote to censure him, but the aim should be only to expose misdeeds to the public. Another impeachment would only be seen as a political move.

We're only 10.5 months into his Presidency, and this is only part of the chaos he is sowing. And only part of the corruption of this administration. Hopefully, the Dems win back some power to at least balance things out, a bit, but it's a long time to wait, in "Trump years."

oh I agree that impeaching him is pointless. I'm just saying that I get it if they do, even if the politics probably isn't going to work the way. By the way I think Carville is right, the Dems should focus on economic rage. That Gatsby-esque thing Trump did at Mar a Lago should be played over and over again as folks suffer during this cost of living crisis