US Politics Thread

[teddytennisfan]

I think he's a good polished speaker... but that doesn't equate to the greatest orator of our lifetime. The substance is often lacking.

OBAMA HAS BEEN THE PERFECT EXAMPLE of exactly what
,
IN HIS gReat work
``ENGLISH AND THE CORRUPTION OF LANGUAGE``


the great GEORGE ORWELL described:

``political speech is the
ACT OF APPEARING TO GIVE SUBSTANCE TO PURE WIND``.

george orwell as everyone knows -- or OUGHT to --
gave examples -- such as the use of stock phrases, banal easy to digest lines that give a semblance of high intellect and veracity - words used to lend weight to a statement where there is really nothing...the constant use of emotion tugging words and connotations - habitual use of words or phrases that carefully obscure , a blithe application of imprecise , malleable meanings...

in the case of obama for example:

`we are the exceptional nation``

LOVELY -- but exceptional in WHAT exactly -- greater productivity, are americans REALLY so efficient in carrying out a similar job as a belgian or french..
are americans exceptional in mathematics, in counting without using the calculator...are americans exceptional in what exactly..

but NEVER MIND SUCH THINGS AND QUESTIONS -- WHAT MATTERS IS THE WORD WAS SAID -- ``èxceptional`` -- ahhhhhhhh..the effect is what matters..but more importantly -- that even if NOT true or UNproved or nothing precise to give as example to add up to ``EXCEPTIONAL NATION``..

evne a LIE such as that is ACCEPTED . THAT`S WHAT MATTERS.
Obama repeatedly said :

`we are the greatest military power -- the best soldiers, the best trained, the most courageous, etc..etc.etc.

```

but exactly HOW - one might ask..
maybe amerifcan soldiers actually fought EQUALLY armed taliban -- but that was never the case...
maybe americans fought such dastardly well-armed vicious GRENADANS...and showed such courage ...
maybe americans were such exceptional people they could even take down all of iraq of hussein -- so long as the iraq planes couldn`t fly for lack of spare parts of course...
maybe americans -- the best trained, most courageous, most effecitve military forc eon earth`s history WON over so many enemies...

except sandal wearing -- rice fed -- vietnamese sent the american army packing from the rooftops of the US embassy by 1968....after having dropped more bombs than ALL of world war 2 globally COMBINED...

SO -- precisely -- how is that the greatest military power on earth..........with such an endless record of FAILURE with TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS of high-tech gear, bombs, global spread, air-conditioned housing, ..............

or how about the ULTIMATE in inside out orwellian language:

Ã’BAMA`S VERY OWN FINAL VALEDICTORY:

```WE SHOWED THE WORLD THAT BIG NATIONS DO NOT BULLY SMALLER WEAKER ONES``..

which should mean the USA is just a small nation -- after all - by a clever twist -- ONLY big nations CAN bully small nations -- and therefore the USA hasn`t bullied small nations --- roflmaooo...

like libya, iraq, yemen, afghanistan, syria, to name just the recent in the loooong list..

but leave it to obama to - as an article title said :
``MAKE AGGRESSION AND WAR CRIMES SOUND ELOQUENT``..

 

[teddytennisfan]

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Putin vs. Obama: Pictorial Comparisons

Red Square
1/14/2014, 1:45 pm

Given that presidential hopefuls are already gearing up for the 2016 election, we'd like to remind you to vote for Vladimir Putin in the Democratic primaries. Any way you look at it, Putin is still cooler than Obama and more experienced than Hillary.

To this effect, we collected, edited, and formatted different versions of pictorial Putin-Obama comparisons that are being circulated on the Internet, bringing them to one easily accessible infographic:

UPDATE:

In order to help toughen President Obama's image on the international arena, the White House released photographs of a shirtless, muscular U.S. President engaged in various manly activities.

 

[JesuslookslikeBorg]

I wonder what Jim Bergerac would make of the Donald as prez ?.

 

[teddytennisfan]

I wonder what Jim Bergerac would make of the Donald as prez ?.

MAYBE HE'S just waiting to see what DONALD presidency REALLY will be like.
such as :

will donald REALLY ''discipline" the NOTORIOUS Criminal gang called CIA? u know the group of boys and girls who go around the world toppling governments and destabilizing countries, training and ''instructing' AL QAEDA, ISIL, DAESH , and similar teen-age romps?

will donald REALLY ''tell china who's boss" in the south china sea -- thousands of miles away where the USA doesn't belong?


will donald REALLY 'remove the USA Missile shield OFFENSIVE nukes and troops in europe ' as russia demans?

will donald REALLY TELL the world -- unlike the LYING US MEDIA --
THAT - UH - IN JUNE 16, 2016...

WHEN A BRITISH TRIDENT NUKE MISSILE 'test' Went awry -- - it shot out of a British Sub and went seriously OFF-course and plopped down in the ocean very near TOWARDS the FLORIDA COAST instead of the atlantic -- -- i bet NEW YORK TIMES COVERED THAT ALREADY............i mean ''covered'' - U KNOW , as in shhhhhh.....

and TELL the world that IT WASN'T THE RUSSIANS?

we'll have to wait and see....

 

[Federberg]

^Do you even know who Bergerac is?

 

[teddytennisfan]

^Do you even know who Bergerac is?

like i care WHICH bergerac s in YOUR MIND?


I HAVE IN MIND CYRANO -- DO YOU?

it's too bad JOHN MILTON didn't anticipate ''LOST our nuke off florida BRITTANIA" instead of writing ''PARADISE LOST".

 

[Federberg]

I could almost believe you'd read some classics

 

[Federberg]

 

[britbox]

^ I've listened to a bit of stuff from Hodges and there is a great documentary series by Noam Chomsky on Netflix called "Requiem For The American Dream" which is well worth a watch.

I've long believed that there has to be a massive shake-up of the status quo. The financial system is broken - they are just kicking the can down the road... one day the road will run out and we'll see the biggest implosion of the global financial system that will make 2008 look like a family picnic.

That was one of the few endearing features of Donald Trump... he's not part of that status quo... and can see the system for what it is... a crumbling infrastructure, money flooding out of the system to the elite, flight of US jobs abroad, terrible trade deals...Don't know if he'll be the man to fix it... it's probably too far gone... but at least he acknowledges it. Still a forthcoming financial armageddon doesn't seem to worry a lot of voters who are fixated on far more trivial matters.

 

[teddytennisfan]

^ I've listened to a bit of stuff from Hodges and there is a great documentary series by Noam Chomsky on Netflix called "Requiem For The American Dream" which is well worth a watch.

I've long believed that there has to be a massive shake-up of the status quo. The financial system is broken - they are just kicking the can down the road... one day the road will run out and we'll see the biggest implosion of the global financial system that will make 2008 look like a family picnic.

That was one of the few endearing features of Donald Trump... he's not part of that status quo... and can see the system for what it is... a crumbling infrastructure, money flooding out of the system to the elite, flight of US jobs abroad, terrible trade deals...Don't know if he'll be the man to fix it... it's probably too far gone... but at least he acknowledges it. Still a forthcoming financial armageddon doesn't seem to worry a lot of voters who are fixated on far more trivial matters.

i think you're right in describing it that way -- and specifically : ''broken financial system".

the scary part is - we don't even know about how that really works in terms of its actual effects throughout the world? i mean what happens in the ''brain centers' of this system -- how does that affect, prices, wages/ savings, pensions. what about social structures across the world? surely people will still be going around living - but the thing is HOW? what's the effect of an implosion on gasoline, oil, gas, its effect on a bakery, someone's savings..currencies, national budgets? that's scary...

i certainly don't understand well how these interconnections are- i mean the technicalities..

but we often hear in the 'financial'/ market [phrases lke "exposure' -- meaning -- what would haen to countries whose economies are more 'exposed" TO this financial system? i know there are countries that - due to ''less exposure' (if that means being procedure-wise and system wise -- not as tied to the workings of this ''central nervous system" , its particular trading , stocks, etc) -- weathered the 2008 events more than others and so could more or less proceed with less damage..but that's also the question -- how much DEEPER is this since the 2008 -- its only lesson to the authors of this catastrophe is -- as we all know

demand that THEY be REWARDED for what they authored..''too big to fail" - more shenanigans, new ''financial packages" ...while it is an economic system that has NO real usefulness fo the actual economy of real people...just pushing make-believe ''wealth" through computers from bank or firm to another .BUT affects the real world so miserably.

clearly that is a lesson russia and china and iran have been keeping an eye on for firming up their gold reserves...sort of ''preparing' for an even bigger collapse of the currency system itself centered around the wall-street , london tandem..IF it does go tha troute....

for one thing -- i DO know that over in asia -- governments are VERY wary of even ''bothering about the euro -- forget expecting much from the EU, both have nowhere to go and might become liabilities to US here"...and are not interested in playing in it (if economists in the philippines under the new government are correct -- accfording to their explanations are the already long-going talks between ASEAN governments)...

 

[teddytennisfan]

^ I've listened to a bit of stuff from Hodges and there is a great documentary series by Noam Chomsky on Netflix called "Requiem For The American Dream" which is well worth a watch.

I've long believed that there has to be a massive shake-up of the status quo. The financial system is broken - they are just kicking the can down the road... one day the road will run out and we'll see the biggest implosion of the global financial system that will make 2008 look like a family picnic.

That was one of the few endearing features of Donald Trump... he's not part of that status quo... and can see the system for what it is... a crumbling infrastructure, money flooding out of the system to the elite, flight of US jobs abroad, terrible trade deals...Don't know if he'll be the man to fix it... it's probably too far gone... but at least he acknowledges it. Still a forthcoming financial armageddon doesn't seem to worry a lot of voters who are fixated on far more trivial matters.

Britbox -- where you are -- are you noticing changes on a general note that points to this seemingly impending financial chaos again?

i mean -- what's going on in terms of -- like daily prices, consumer goods, food, petrol, etc anyway?

 

[britbox]

Britbox -- where you are -- are you noticing changes on a general note that points to this seemingly impending financial chaos again?

i mean -- what's going on in terms of -- like daily prices, consumer goods, food, petrol, etc anyway?

Nothing new... I've thought it for a few years. There are derivates timebombs tucked away... as we saw in 2008, it only takes a trigger and then you can engineer a seismic knock on effect. Most investors know it's there, but the scale is hard to measure. Buffett and all the big investors know about it. That's why governments and investors snap up precious metals. 2008 happened very quickly.

We know what happens when these financial crashes occur.. people get raped of their money. Every time a government prints money they are stealing citizens money through devaluation. Most people don't notice - they still see the same figure on the bank statement (unless you're in Cyprus where they actually went and helped themselves to cash)... but in real terms the money has less value. I think after the next giant crash (which could be massive), individuals on the ground will diversify into using decentralised currencies a lot more... stuff like Bitcoin et al.

 

[teddytennisfan]

Nothing new... I've thought it for a few years. There are derivates timebombs tucked away... as we saw in 2008, it only takes a trigger and then you can engineer a seismic knock on effect. Most investors know it's there, but the scale is hard to measure. Buffett and all the big investors know about it. That's why governments and investors snap up precious metals. 2008 happened very quickly.

We know what happens when these financial crashes occur.. people get raped of their money. Every time a government prints money they are stealing citizens money through devaluation. Most people don't notice - they still see the same figure on the bank statement (unless you're in Cyprus where they actually went and helped themselves to cash)... but in real terms the money has less value. I think after the next giant crash (which could be massive), individuals on the ground will diversify into using decentralised currencies a lot more... stuff like Bitcoin et al.

especially on your ending statement..maybe that's what a younger generation which is already in a sense ''existing" with its own habits and way of doing things will eventually be well adjusted in a sense...
u know how it is -- different new trends -- and people somehow adapt...

i think tha'ts what's also going on as people have no time to deal with the usual games - and they want to buy clothes, they want to buy this and that - get paid this and that way -- and somehow ''translate" what they have, their money in their bank into a different way of making it ''a tool of value".

just like you said - things like bitcoin, virtual currency and such...mong many other things probably.

still -- it's like waiting for a gigantic earthquake that you know is coming ..

 

[britbox]

especially on your ending statement..maybe that's what a younger generation which is already in a sense ''existing" with its own habits and way of doing things will eventually be well adjusted in a sense...
u know how it is -- different new trends -- and people somehow adapt...

i think tha'ts what's also going on as people have no time to deal with the usual games - and they want to buy clothes, they want to buy this and that - get paid this and that way -- and somehow ''translate" what they have, their money in their bank into a different way of making it ''a tool of value".

just like you said - things like bitcoin, virtual currency and such...mong many other things probably.

still -- it's like waiting for a gigantic earthquake that you know is coming ..

The drive to a cashless society is really all about top-level control... they'll try and have you believe it's all about convenience. Bitcoin and other virtual currencies could fill the void.

 

[teddytennisfan]

The drive to a cashless society is really all about top-level control... they'll try and have you believe it's all about convenience. Bitcoin and other virtual currencies could fill the void.

i agree -- that ''cashless" society REALLY scares me...it's so sinister - downright malevolent ..and INDIA under modi has already begun -- after a ''visit' by - who else but some goldman sachs ''advisers" representing -- from the reports i read -- huge ''credit debit card" US companies...can you imagine? because india has tradictionally been very LEERY of credit cards nd debit cards , it turns out -- and the american companies were eyeing it for decades -- but couldn't make an inroad to get indians embrace '' plastic money " - they just rpefer to actually have real cash in their hands ...

and so -- THAT was he ''reform" that was forced on them...who reports that in the western media really? but that is what they did...

when he declared it around november? OVERNIGHT it threw millions into EVEN POORER state..because now - what little money they had -- suddenly worthless -- ..

truly sinister...how can people do that?

 

[Federberg]

I don't think there are any obvious signs of impending collapse, in fact left to itself, the global financial system is trying to recover. Slow joyless economic recoveries are the inevitable consequence of financial collapses such as the one we had in 2008. The issue here is that Trump's economic nationalist policies could be the trigger to turn what was a pretty bad financial collapse into something eerily similar to the events that conspired to create the global depression. Smoot-Hawley was the one ingredient lacking this time around that would have made 2008 look almost the same as in the aftermath of the stock collapse in 1929. That was the protectionist trade tariff imposed by legislators in the wake of the 1929 bear market, "American goods for American consumers" is all well and good, but when the inevitable retaliation happens it triggers a cycle of retaliation and destruction of global trade that leads to economic depression and 30% unemployment. This is what we have to look out for now.

Bannon said it in his speech last week, Trump is an economic nationalist, and this is logically what economic nationalism is all about. I don't see how he'll be allowed to do this though, as the GOP in Congress tends to be pro-trade. Besides I think that corporate America will fight with everything they have to prevent this. The moment you hear that congressmen and senators would be willing to enact protectionist legislation then run for the hills folks, and buy as many canned goods as you can..

 

[britbox]

I don't think there are any obvious signs of impending collapse, in fact left to itself, the global financial system is trying to recover. Slow joyless economic recoveries are the inevitable consequence of financial collapses such as the one we had in 2008. The issue here is that Trump's economic nationalist policies could be the trigger to turn what was a pretty bad financial collapse into something eerily similar to the events that conspired to create the global depression. Smoot-Hawley was the one ingredient lacking this time around that would have made 2008 look almost the same as in the aftermath of the stock collapse in 1929. That was the protectionist trade tariff imposed by legislators in the wake of the 1929 bear market, "American goods for American consumers" is all well and good, but when the inevitable retaliation happens it triggers a cycle of retaliation and destruction of global trade that leads to economic depression and 30% unemployment. This is what we have to look out for now.

Bannon said it in his speech last week, Trump is an economic nationalist, and this is logically what economic nationalism is all about. I don't see how he'll be allowed to do this though, as the GOP in Congress tends to be pro-trade. Besides I think that corporate America will fight with everything they have to prevent this. The moment you hear that congressmen and senators would be willing to enact protectionist legislation then run for the hills folks, and buy as many canned goods as you can..

You must see that the status quo is unsustainable in the long run though Federberg.

There's lots of different strand to this discussion but I'll ask you about one.

Just on a very simple principle from a national perspective...

1. The jobs flow abroad from western nations as western corporates look to reduce costs by moving manufacturing and many services overseas.
2. The biggest markets they are selling back into are western ones - fuelled by consumerism.
3. In real terms, wages in the west have dropped, so Mummy Bear joins Daddy Bear in the workforce... all inspired by wimmins rights. It's liberating for sure. Housing has become unaffordable for many on one wage.
4. The job market shrinks... Job security is out of the window... those old jobs for life are long gone.
5. No problem, easy credit is here.... Everyone gets credit...
6. The job market shrinks further... Some Bears are out of work. Some lose their houses. A financial crisis occurs. The rest of the population see the value of their savings cut by "quantitive easing"... cos it would be a national disaster if companies like Goldman Sachs went bust... clearly The gov will throw Lehman Bros under the bus.... at least one of them had to go... but we'll keep the cartel who run the Fed Reserve. More people lose their jobs and houses.
7. People are running out of the easy credit they got in Step 5... for some it's long exhausted...
8. The consumerism begins to slow down.
9. The domestic market starts shrinking
10. Corporates look to cut costs further...
11. While the population is rising.

Solutions??! I'm not seeing globalisation as that rosy for the most part.... except for those at the top of the tree.

 

[Federberg]

http://www.counterpunch.org/2017/02/27/the-republicans-may-impeach-trump/

interesting article, and I like the nod to Heinlein's "Stranger in a strange land"

 

[Federberg]

You must see that the status quo is unsustainable in the long run though Federberg.

There's lots of different strand to this discussion but I'll ask you about one.

Just on a very simple principle from a national perspective...

1. The jobs flow abroad from western nations as western corporates look to reduce costs by moving manufacturing and many services overseas.
2. The biggest markets they are selling back into are western ones - fuelled by consumerism.
3. In real terms, wages in the west have dropped, so Mummy Bear joins Daddy Bear in the workforce... all inspired by wimmins rights. It's liberating for sure. Housing has become unaffordable for many on one wage.
4. The job market shrinks... Job security is out of the window... those old jobs for life are long gone.
5. No problem, easy credit is here.... Everyone gets credit...
6. The job market shrinks further... Some Bears are out of work. Some lose their houses. A financial crisis occurs. The rest of the population see the value of their savings cut by "quantitive easing"... cos it would be a national disaster if companies like Goldman Sachs went bust... clearly The gov will throw Lehman Bros under the bus.... at least one of them had to go... but we'll keep the cartel who run the Fed Reserve. More people lose their jobs and houses.
7. People are running out of the easy credit they got in Step 5... for some it's long exhausted...
8. The consumerism begins to slow down.
9. The domestic market starts shrinking
10. Corporates look to cut costs further...
11. While the population is rising.

Solutions??! I'm not seeing globalisation as that rosy for the most part.... except for those at the top of the tree.

I agree that globalisation has not been implemented correctly. As I've said before, governments have allowed big business to arbitrage wages and taxes across countries. This is not the fault of global trade though, this is all about implementation and the solutions are relatively simple albeit the corporate lobby is so powerful it would take a powerful but sensible populist to come in and fix it (not just in one country, all countries have to do this for it to work). And by the way, even if Trump's solution - protectionism and tariffs - wasn't likely to be an unmitigated disaster (I'm convinced about that), corporates would fight back by automating first instead of hiring more workers. I acknowledge there is a huge problem but what Trump is likely to do will be a disaster the likes of which we haven't seen since the 1930s and I'm not exaggerating this. One final point... the irony of all of this, is that the hard work has been done, and the US and Europe are about to see the benefits of wealthier developing nations starting to consume their products and stuff like this will make the whole exercise pointless... just when the benefits are about to become apparent. It would be funny if it wasn't so serious

 

[britbox]

Corporates will always automate anyway where possible, it's just when it becomes cost-effective to do it.

Automation combined with Rampant Capitalism is actually the problem.

As everything becomes more automated... you actually wonder what people will be for. Interesting.

People will actually be manufacturing a lot of their own stuff in the near future as the 3D Printing Technology improves... assuming they can afford one.