Sweden's Problem

Moxie

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You know this is pretty discredited, right? Non-journalist and bad edit job? What are you going for here?
 
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Nekro

You know this is pretty discredited, right? Non-journalist and bad edit job? What are you going for here?
The migration in Europe is a disaster, i can confirm this. I live in Hungary and we're having problems nonstop with the illegal migrants even now that we have a wall and we're building the second one.

The problems these people are causing are horrible and there ARE rapists among them. These people are travelling from country to country. Like in one case an Iraqi rapist committed violence against a 13 year old girl in Germany then fled here to hide, however, the German police asked our help and the perpetrator got caught. (I post the police sources here if you want). Another happening was when a Syrian came here from Sweden, lied to a woman that he was a Greek businessman and committed sexual violence against her.

The mainstream western media writes nothing about these stories, which is logical, Merkel is trying to save her skin.

The reaction of most western liberals is very bad in my opinion, they are in COMPLETE denial. Also the reaction of most Brits who are not experiencing the mainland chaos. They are in complete denial too.


About Sweden, they are posing to the outside as if they could handle the migrants but at the same time they are harassing my country for example, they want us to take the migrants back who got registered here first (lots of people, we're at the edge of the EU), which is ridiculous cause my government was against Merkel's agenda from the start, also we don't have the capacity to put those people here. The Swedes threatened us with the Dublin Convention and just recently Morgan Johansson came to my country again to persuade us to take back migrants... So Swedes are trying very hard to get rid of the migrants...
 

Moxie

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What information in the video is incorrect?
Before I back up my post, would you like to answer my question, which is to back up yours with what would you like to say about Sweden?
 

britbox

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Sweden is one of the best illustrations of the damage caused by policies of allowing mass immigration. Why did the migrants choose Sweden? Because of a hugely favourable welfare system. Now Sweden is paying a heavy price.
 
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Moxie

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Sweden is one of the best illustrations of the damage caused by policies of allowing mass immigration. Why did the migrants choose Sweden? Because of a hugely favourable welfare system. Now Sweden is paying a heavy price.
In what sense? And in what way, compared to other European countries? Understanding that the Swedes don't agree with this assessment, right?
 

britbox

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Violent crime, riots, attacks on the police and journalists. Look beyond the crime "stats" and listen to what the people on the ground are saying.

Rinkeby was only on fire yesterday in Stockholm... widescale arson...
 
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Moxie

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Violent crime, riots, attacks on the police and journalists. Look beyond the crime "stats" and listen to what the people on the ground are saying.

Rinkeby was only on fire yesterday in Stockholm... widescale arson...
What are the people on the ground saying, beyond that video you posted, which I've shown to you is said to be selectively edited? The not-elevated crime stats aren't good enough for you? I suspect you just want to believe the hype you're reading from afar, if it supports your world-view that immigrants are a blight on an otherwise "happy" (homogenous) society. Yes, there was unfortunately a riot in an immigrant neighborhood yesterday. Not like that never happens in Britain or France or the US. And not always by migrants...but usually because people are poor.
 
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Nekro

Violent crime, riots, attacks on the police and journalists. Look beyond the crime "stats" and listen to what the people on the ground are saying.

Rinkeby was only on fire yesterday in Stockholm... widescale arson...
Yes, better to listen to the people. Italy is turning into a dump too. Lol My gf is working in a townhall in Italy and she's having nonstop problems with the migrants. Not only that, when i was going with her to a supermarket it was surrounded by migrants, some selling junk. One of them came after us blablablablaing nonstop, my gf said it was good i was with her cause otherwise he would have followed her to her car.

Just go to Milano centrale, 5 years ago it was ok, even 4-3 years ago it was tolerable, last year even the green park area where there used to be food and souvenir sellers were full of the migrants, it became a horrible place...
 
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britbox

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What are the people on the ground saying, beyond that video you posted, which I've shown to you is said to be selectively edited? The not-elevated crime stats aren't good enough for you? I suspect you just want to believe the hype you're reading from afar, if it supports your world-view that immigrants are a blight on an otherwise "happy" (homogenous) society. Yes, there was unfortunately a riot in an immigrant neighborhood yesterday. Not like that never happens in Britain or France or the US. And not always by migrants...but usually because people are poor.

Sweden has the most generous welfare system in Europe... so don't give me the poor argument for this riot... it was triggered by police trying to arrest a drug dealer outside a train station.

The non-elevated crime stats aren't good enough for the Swedish police... who aren't "afar" and are facing the real life scenario, (the one you describe as "hype")... senior police have broken ranks and risked their careers to explain the government is hiding a massive crimewave instigated by immigrants.
 
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Moxie

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Yes, better to listen to the people. Italy is turning into a dump too. Lol My gf is working in a townhall in Italy and she's having nonstop problems with the migrants. Not only that, when i was going with her to a supermarket it was surrounded by migrants, some selling junk. One of them came after us blablablablaing nonstop, my gf said it was good i was with her cause otherwise he would have followed her to her car.

Just go to Milano centrale, 5 years ago it was ok, even 4-3 years ago it was tolerable, last year even the green park area where there used to be food and souvenir sellers were full of the migrants, it became a horrible place...
Nekro, while it's interesting to have the anecdotal view from the ground, it doesn't tell the whole story. You mentioned rape and sexual violence in your post above, but these things, sadly, happen with or without the presence of migrants. It's really just enflaming to mention rape specifically without facts. I lived in Italy in the '80s, and there were areas that were horrible because of the drug epidemic, and there were virtually no migrants in the country.

Here are some statistics that might be more helpful on the public opinion front: http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/09/16/european-opinions-of-the-refugee-crisis-in-5-charts/
 

Moxie

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Sweden has the most generous welfare system in Europe... so don't give me the poor argument for this riot... it was triggered by police trying to arrest a drug dealer outside a train station.

The non-elevated crime stats aren't good enough for the Swedish police... who aren't "afar" and are facing the real life scenario, (the one you describe as "hype")... senior police have broken ranks and risked their careers to explain the government is hiding a massive crimewave instigated by immigrants.
It's fine for you to distill it that way, but I'd prefer a link to that. Thanks.
 
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britbox

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It's fine for you to distill it that way, but I'd prefer a link to that. Thanks.

http://www.breitbart.com/london/201...ing-due-uncontrolled-immigration-no-go-zones/

^ You won't like the publisher, but don't shoot the messenger. The words are from the former head of Malmo Police.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world...ious-crimes-Sweden-police-officer-blasts-rant

Peter Springare, Senior Detective, NCIS, Sweden

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/749735/Sweden-police-malmo-not-safe-NYE-thugs-grenade-attack
 
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Nekro

Nekro, while it's interesting to have the anecdotal view from the ground, it doesn't tell the whole story. You mentioned rape and sexual violence in your post above, but these things, sadly, happen with or without the presence of migrants. It's really just enflaming to mention rape specifically without facts. I lived in Italy in the '80s, and there were areas that were horrible because of the drug epidemic, and there were virtually no migrants in the country.

Here are some statistics that might be more helpful on the public opinion front: http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/09/16/european-opinions-of-the-refugee-crisis-in-5-charts/
ok Here's the latest raper from germany, an Iraqi man,he raped a 13 year old girl in Germany, he was caught by his fingerprints https://kuruc.info/r/59/169658/ you can use google translator. some of these people are acting like they're on some kind of rape holiday in Europe. The sources there are official police sources and official police video.


About Italy, i just told you those places turned into a dump BECAUSE of the presence on the migrants, and it made the experience of living there worse for the locals (like my gf) and for tourists (like me) And the stereotypical reaction of outsiders is to link some stats and polls which are the most easily manipulated materials and state that those are somehow superior to the actual experiences of the people.
 
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Moxie

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ok Here's the latest raper from germany, an Iraqi man,he raped a 13 year old girl in Germany, he was caught by his fingerprints https://kuruc.info/r/59/169658/ you can use google translator. some of these people are acting like they're on some kind of rape holiday in Europe. The sources there are official police sources and official police video.

About Italy, i just told you those places turned into a dump BECAUSE of the presence on the migrants, and it made the experience of living there worse for the locals (like my gf) and for tourists (like me) And the stereotypical reaction of outsiders is to link some stats and polls which are the most easily manipulated materials and state that those are somehow superior to the actual experiences of the people.

I'm sorry to say that one rape in your example doesn't mean that plenty of rapes don't happen without the presence of migrants. I'm not excusing that particular assault, I'm just suggesting that you're cherry-picking an incident. It doesn't make for a complete experience of migrants in a country. Or allow that there isn't a certain level of sexual assault that already exists. Sadly.

About Italy, I'm telling you I lived there, and I go back there often, and I have a lot of friends there. There were places that were a dump before there were migrants because of drug problems. And the Mafia, now that you mention it. But if you're saying that Italy has become a DUMP overall, I'd say you're wrong. And this is from my personal knowledge on the ground, and from Italian friends from forever. One of the worst things to happen to Italy in the last decade and a half has been the brain drain of liberal intellectuals who have finally fled after too many years of Berlusconi and the extreme right.
 

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My understanding is that the data doesn't support an increase in crime in Sweden. Far from it. But we live in a world where the far right is stronger, and they'll tell you a narrative to fit their own facts. Funnily enough I have an ex-colleague of mine who moved to Stockholm. I asked him about this, and he just rolled his eyes. He's not lefty either by the way.
 
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Moxie

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You're right on not believing Breitbart. It's not a question of shooting the messenger as much as not him having no credibility. I did read it. Not that Malmo had just swapped problems with biker gangs for the current ones. It's not like some lovely Swedish place just got polluted.

And kind of the same with the Express. It's a tabloid. Can't you find a better source? I did bring you more neutral links. Your sources are inclined to a certain sensationalism, so your opinion could go that way, if you buy into it.
 

Moxie

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My understanding is that the data doesn't support an increase in crime in Sweden. Far from it. But we live in a world where the far right is stronger, and they'll tell you a narrative to fit their own facts. Funnily enough I have an ex-colleague of mine who moved to Stockholm. I asked him about this, and he just rolled his eyes. He's not lefty either by the way.
Also anecdotal, but at least it's a report from the ground.