BOARD TALK
The fastest growing tennis discussion forum on the planet.


Post Reply 
Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
Author Message
Denisovich Offline
Grand Slam Champion
*******

Posts: 3,826
Likes Given: 1,325
Likes Received: 877 in 627 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/tennis/...r-fine.ap/

Isnâ€t this a bit out of proportion? And does it make sense in the first place? The ATP seems to be covering up mistakes by its umpires, or at least punishing players for standing up against unjust calls? The ump was clearly wrong:

https://twitter.com/Stako_tennis/status/...57/photo/1
31-May-2013 03:11 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
johnsteinbeck Offline
Major Winner
******

Posts: 1,010
Likes Given: 338
Likes Received: 307 in 177 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
^ looking at how often we now get to see the pic of him snapping the photo, i wonder if Lotto (whose logo is featured four times on that pic) might re-imburse him.

also - do you see the ball as that clearly in? tbh, i don't. i think it's a real close call, and one that might be better seen in person than on a twitter pic.

either way, i do think that Stakhovsky knows that this is not how you settle a dispute, and 7% of the price money is not actually that much, considering it's a real publicity stunt on his side. if he had just taken the pic and submitted it to ITF/RG officials afterwards, instead of making it go viral, the penalty might have been even less, i reckon. (also, do we know who was issuing the penalty? because i'd be somewhat surprised if it's the ATP doing it at an ITF event.)
31-May-2013 03:21 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
tented Offline
Potential GOAT
*********

Posts: 11,618
Likes Given: 4,705
Likes Received: 3,392 in 2,108 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
(31-May-2013 03:11 AM)Denisovich Wrote:  http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/tennis/...r-fine.ap/

Isnâ€t this a bit out of proportion? And does it make sense in the first place? The ATP seems to be covering up mistakes by its umpires, or at least punishing players for standing up against unjust calls? The ump was clearly wrong:

https://twitter.com/Stako_tennis/status/...57/photo/1

First I'm hearing of this incident. Did the umpire call it in, but Stakhovsky thought it was out, or vice versa? I agree with johnsteinbeck: it's not exactly crystal-clear, 100% proof of anything.

Did anyone watch this match? Was it on a court with Hawk-Eye? Broadcasters in the US often show that graphic, even though it isn't official.
31-May-2013 03:39 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
johnsteinbeck Offline
Major Winner
******

Posts: 1,010
Likes Given: 338
Likes Received: 307 in 177 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
^ ump called it out, Stakhovsky thought it was in. (the fact that you still have to ask after seeing the pic, and assumed Stakhovsky might have seen this as proof that it was out shows just how close it really was).
it was on Lenglen. btw, i've always wondered whether the Hawkeye graphic they use on non-Hawkeye tournaments is actually the real, fully licensed and calibrated deal, or just an approximation based on TV cameras. either way, i'd assume that this ball might have been within the margin of error.

also, unlike the call, the match was far from being close - in straights, 1, 4 and 3.. so much ado about nothing, really.
(This post was last modified: 31-May-2013 03:47 AM by johnsteinbeck.)
31-May-2013 03:46 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
tented Offline
Potential GOAT
*********

Posts: 11,618
Likes Given: 4,705
Likes Received: 3,392 in 2,108 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
(31-May-2013 03:46 AM)johnsteinbeck Wrote:  it was on Lenglen. btw, i've always wondered whether the Hawkeye graphic they use on non-Hawkeye tournaments is actually the real, fully licensed and calibrated deal, or just an approximation based on TV cameras.

Good question. They call it "Hawk-Eye" and with trademark laws in the US, they wouldn't be using that name unless they're actually using it. And if they're using it, they're using it, right? It wouldn't be good for their reputation if someone disclosed that they're using an inadequate version.

Quote: also, unlike the call, the match was far from being close - in straights, 1, 4 and 3.. so much ado about nothing, really.

There is that ...
31-May-2013 03:57 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Denisovich Offline
Grand Slam Champion
*******

Posts: 3,826
Likes Given: 1,325
Likes Received: 877 in 627 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
(31-May-2013 03:21 AM)johnsteinbeck Wrote:  ^ looking at how often we now get to see the pic of him snapping the photo, i wonder if Lotto (whose logo is featured four times on that pic) might re-imburse him.

also - do you see the ball as that clearly in? tbh, i don't. i think it's a real close call, and one that might be better seen in person than on a twitter pic.

either way, i do think that Stakhovsky knows that this is not how you settle a dispute, and 7% of the price money is not actually that much, considering it's a real publicity stunt on his side. if he had just taken the pic and submitted it to ITF/RG officials afterwards, instead of making it go viral, the penalty might have been even less, i reckon. (also, do we know who was issuing the penalty? because i'd be somewhat surprised if it's the ATP doing it at an ITF event.)

Well, why should he not be allowed to do this? He should be allowed to voice his opinion on public on the matter and not be shut down by the authorities. Even if he is wrong on the call itself. I don't get why they are punishing someone for expressing his opinion. It's not that he is being racist or trashtalking anyone. He just published a pic of a ball mark.

The outcome of the match has absolutely nothing to do with this.
31-May-2013 06:14 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
johnsteinbeck Offline
Major Winner
******

Posts: 1,010
Likes Given: 338
Likes Received: 307 in 177 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
he's allowed to voice his opinion. but getting out your phone during the match, and snapping pictures? do you really think that this is in line with how a professional sports match should be played? imagine NFL players on the sideline using their smartphones to tape the action and dispute calls on that base?
the fact that he published it isn't another infringement as such, but it's a question of attitude. to me, it's adding insult to injury, honestly.

i think it's just bad form. not a major thing, mind you. but it's also not the first time he's done something like it, and i doubt ITF/ATP would want this to catch on.

btw, Stakhovsky himself recognized he broke the rules and that a penalty was in order, and wouldn't complain about it.
Quote:The 101st-ranked Ukrainian said he would pay a fine which tournament organisers are now set to levy at the end of the fortnight and recognised he had overstepped the mark.
(...)
"But it was wrong. The rule book says you can't do it. Some media have made a big thing of it. But that's pathetic - I was quite calm, I had a nice chat with the umpire. It was more a joke than anything and I hope people won't judge me that badly. It was near the beginning of the match."
via News.com.au
31-May-2013 06:34 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Denisovich Offline
Grand Slam Champion
*******

Posts: 3,826
Likes Given: 1,325
Likes Received: 877 in 627 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
Ok if they have a rule that says you cannot make pictures during a match I guess a warning is in order, but a fine? It seems a bit disproportionate to me.
31-May-2013 07:06 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
johnsteinbeck Offline
Major Winner
******

Posts: 1,010
Likes Given: 338
Likes Received: 307 in 177 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
^ again - it's not the first time he's done it, he did pretty much the same thing at Munich just a couple of weeks ago. so that might explain why they went with the fine.

Quote:"Munich was a very close call which could go both ways, so I didn't really bother going to the supervisor and asking. But this one is in a Grand Slam, so first of all, the fine is actually there, possibly, (and) I don't want to get it. So I'll try to explain myself. I don't know if it's going to work."

"I hope my clean Grand Slam record will count - I've never been fined. I made a mistake. The question now is the size of it (the fine)."
given that he also is the guy who gave a great interview on the life of someone higher up in the ranks (explaining how he's on a net loss after IW and Miami, with all the expenses), i actually do feel for him. he seems like a clever and funny guy - Gasquet said so himself. so, some sort of a formal slap on the wrist would've been nice, maybe a lesser penalty, idk (a 'warning' as such probably doesn't work off-court). then again, i still think that he didn't make things better by publishing the pic. or maybe he did, as the twit-pic media attention might actually help him in regards to sponsors and such, and might off-set the 2,000 loss.
31-May-2013 07:35 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
isabelle Offline
Major Winner
******

Posts: 1,984
Likes Given: 31
Likes Received: 432 in 320 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
Hawk eye system should be installed IMO
31-May-2013 07:56 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
the AntiPusher Offline
Multiple Slam Winner
********

Posts: 5,161
Likes Given: 919
Likes Received: 1,282 in 962 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
Well, this idiot surely got his $ worthLay Down Laughing
31-May-2013 08:04 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
tented Offline
Potential GOAT
*********

Posts: 11,618
Likes Given: 4,705
Likes Received: 3,392 in 2,108 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
(31-May-2013 07:56 AM)isabelle Wrote:  Hawk eye system should be installed IMO

Exactly. No excuse not to use it. Traditions can be quaint, but this is the 21st century.
31-May-2013 08:21 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Broken_Shoelace Offline
Multiple Slam Winner
********

Posts: 6,174
Likes Given: 915
Likes Received: 2,590 in 1,545 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
Just use the challenge system. Everyone would be happy, especially the umpires who won't have to come down from their chairs every other point.
31-May-2013 08:43 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Denisovich Offline
Grand Slam Champion
*******

Posts: 3,826
Likes Given: 1,325
Likes Received: 877 in 627 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
I fourth that. Although you would be preferring technology over physical evidence, but I trust hawkeye.
31-May-2013 11:21 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
johnsteinbeck Offline
Major Winner
******

Posts: 1,010
Likes Given: 338
Likes Received: 307 in 177 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
(31-May-2013 08:21 AM)tented Wrote:  
(31-May-2013 07:56 AM)isabelle Wrote:  Hawk eye system should be installed IMO

Exactly. No excuse not to use it. Traditions can be quaint, but this is the 21st century.

dunno where i read it/heard it... but one potential issue is actually very much like the Stakhovsky case: imagine a player disagreeing with HawkEye on the base of a ball mark. the margin of error for HawkEye is 3mm. that can make a big difference; and if a mark were to actually prove HawkEye Wrong - wouldn't that jeopardize the system's credibility and acceptance elsewhere?
(This post was last modified: 31-May-2013 02:13 PM by johnsteinbeck.)
31-May-2013 02:13 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Front242 Offline
Dyslexia For Cure Found
*********

Posts: 15,762
Likes Given: 2,925
Likes Received: 3,609 in 2,602 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
(31-May-2013 08:04 AM)the AntiPusher Wrote:  Well, this idiot surely got his $ worthLay Down Laughing

Can't see why he's an idiot tbh. If you don't stand up for yourself in life people will just walk all over you. He tried to get some justice but in fairness the punishment was too harsh. A warning would've sufficed for the "idiot".
31-May-2013 02:23 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
JesuslookslikeBorg Offline
Grand Slam Champion
*******

Posts: 4,657
Likes Given: 337
Likes Received: 966 in 695 posts
Joined: Apr 2013
RE: Stakhovsky gets a $2,000 penalty for proving the umpire was wrong
taking a pic of an inconclusive mark ??..what a gimp, serves him right.

knowing me alan partridge, knowing you tennis frontier..ah ha.
31-May-2013 07:13 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)